Who do you blame Dana ufc or Jones?

I can go both ways here but at the end of the day its the UFC's job to put together a card where the co main can step in and replace the main event with no issues. A couple of years ago this was no problem but with all of the events etc they have fucked themselves. Outside of hendo jones this was by far one of the worst cards I have ever seen hands down. Hell the fox cards have been great as of late so why the lame as cards for 60 bucks. UFC has to get their shit together before they fuck it all up an yes IMO Bones is a pussy as other than chael being a southpaw he was a very similar match up as hendo with less power.

Plenty I just don't understand about yesterday.
https://ninjasplace.forumotion.net/t18932-things-i-don-t-understand-about-yesterday-s-mess

Bones is about 90% maybe more to blame to me, which is substantial.

Jones.

Jones, but Dana is now just a press man with no balls. He acts Luke he runs shot when fighters need to go. Mayhem, torres, etc. He is a yes man now when it comes to top talent

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Of course Bones deserves blame but Zuffa should take alot of heat for not having back up plans for these scenarios.

Did they even try and attempt to demote the card to FX or Fuel ?

Ali wrote:

Of course Bones deserves blame but Zuffa should take alot of heat for not having back up plans for these scenarios.

Did they even try and attempt to demote the card to FX or Fuel ?

They asked Dana about that yesterday. I think it was a time issue. Full video and transcript is here.
https://ninjasplace.forumotion.net/t18924p105-jon-jones-refuses-to-fight-anyone-at-ufc-151-after-hendo-hurt-ufc-151-canceled-jones-fights-september-vs-machida

OU wrote:

Ali wrote:

Of course Bones deserves blame but Zuffa should take alot of heat for not having back up plans for these scenarios.

Did they even try and attempt to demote the card to FX or Fuel ?

They asked Dana about that yesterday. I think it was a time issue. Full video and transcript is here.
https://ninjasplace.forumotion.net/t18924p105-jon-jones-refuses-to-fight-anyone-at-ufc-151-after-hendo-hurt-ufc-151-canceled-jones-fights-september-vs-machida

That's good then but still to cancel a whole show because of one fight is a bit drastic, do they desperately need PPV revenue ?

Ali wrote:

OU wrote:

Ali wrote:

Of course Bones deserves blame but Zuffa should take alot of heat for not having back up plans for these scenarios.

Did they even try and attempt to demote the card to FX or Fuel ?

They asked Dana about that yesterday. I think it was a time issue. Full video and transcript is here.
https://ninjasplace.forumotion.net/t18924p105-jon-jones-refuses-to-fight-anyone-at-ufc-151-after-hendo-hurt-ufc-151-canceled-jones-fights-september-vs-machida

That's good then but still to cancel a whole show because of one fight is a bit drastic, do they desperately need PPV revenue ?

I don't think it was about PPV revenue. If they could have made it a free card, I'm sure they would have. But it was probably too short of notice to get it on TV. I think they are contracted for a certain # of events so they might of had to cancel a future TV event, or maybe they couldn't get it on TV because of programming issues? Not sure, but there has to be something to it.

Sucks for this guy
http://www.mmamania.com/2012/8/24/3265385/jon-jones-ufc-151-canceled-twitter-jonnybones-mma

Quote :

Jon Jones
@jonjones
haha! The UFC fighter Jon Jones backed out of a fight and now I'm getting flooded with horrible, cruel insults because people think I'm him.

Quote :

Jon Jones
@jonjones
@ResidencyMMA I had it first! Just because some guy's a colossal pussy everyone hates doesn't mean I'm gonna give up my name.

It's not as easy as just moving the card to free TV. These things have to be scheduled well in advance just like venue's do. FX has set programing and they can't just change it up to put prelims on or a full card at the drop of a hat and say "fuck you" to the other programs/movies they paid rights to/got contracts for. Eight days notice is not enough time. That's why these cards are initially announced a couple months ahead of time.

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

http://www.mmamania.com/2012/8/24/3264952/the-ufc-151-debacle-blame-list-who-you-should-be-mad-at-and-why
Found this quote to be interesting.

Quote :

Kawa wanted Jones to take the fight, but Greg Jackson didn't and Jones listened to Greg. The only fault Kawa has is that he was unable to convince his client (if he even believed it in the first place) to take the fight against Sonnen or whatever other opponent the UFC offered.

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

If he was not barred from competing, he would be I think. Zuffa's doctors ended up with the final say after examining him I have heard. It's a non-op injury and the diagnosis three weeks ago might of said you are out or it might of said he would be good in he four weeks for the fight, I don't know.

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

didnt the injury take place last sunday tho?

Besides, Dan couldn't have known Jones would be a baby bitch about it and refuse to fight anyone but him.

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

Actually, it was the UFC doctor who said he cannot compete, not the camp.

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

Actually, it was the UFC doctor who said he cannot compete, not the camp.

Should someone in the camp had a UFC doctor come in sooner? Like when the injury happened, or sometime during the time where Dan wasn't able to train? Again credit to Dan for trying to fight through it. But knowing what we know know, should they have had it checked out earlier?

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Ludo wrote:

Besides, Dan couldn't have known Jones would be a baby bitch about it and refuse to fight anyone but him.

Obviously Dan knows the more notice he can give, the better.