Who do you blame Dana ufc or Jones?

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

Actually, it was the UFC doctor who said he cannot compete, not the camp.

Should someone in the camp had a UFC doctor come in sooner? Like when the injury happened, or sometime during the time where Dan wasn't able to train? Again credit to Dan for trying to fight through it. But knowing what we know know, should they have had it checked out earlier?

Do we know when the injury actually happened? I still am not sure that news is out? maybe i missed it

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

That's not something you do to your fighter, though. These guys are supposed to trust the people in their camp, thats why they spend the money to fly them out to work with them. Ultimately it's the fighter's decision to pull out or go in all fucked up. The only people you can trust with inside information like that are the people directly around you in camp.

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

Besides, Dan couldn't have known Jones would be a baby bitch about it and refuse to fight anyone but him.

Obviously Dan knows the more notice he can give, the better.

I agree there, but nobody saw Jones' bullshit coming in all this. I think everyone, including Dan, assumed that Jones would roll with it and just make it work like 99% of the people in his position would have.

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

Actually, it was the UFC doctor who said he cannot compete, not the camp.

Should someone in the camp had a UFC doctor come in sooner? Like when the injury happened, or sometime during the time where Dan wasn't able to train? Again credit to Dan for trying to fight through it. But knowing what we know know, should they have had it checked out earlier?

Do we know when the injury actually happened? I still am not sure that news is out? maybe i missed it

http://www.mmamania.com/2012/8/24/3265907/ufc-151-dan-henderson-jon-jones-vitor-belfort
"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

it really has, i wouldnt think of ordering 150 or 151! even if there were no injuries

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

They HAVE attempted to, though. 2012 is the year of the injury.

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

That's not something you do to your fighter, though. These guys are supposed to trust the people in their camp, thats why they spend the money to fly them out to work with them. Ultimately it's the fighter's decision to pull out or go in all fucked up. The only people you can trust with inside information like that are the people directly around you in camp.

Exactly. My question is, did his camp do the right thing? Should they have got Dan checked by the "official UFC doctor" sooner? Again though, hindsight is 20/20. Easy to look back now and say maybe he should have done this or that.

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

Without knowing how it would effect him a week or two down the line it's best not to say anything. For all he knew he'd be feeling alright in a week or two and the fight wouldn't have been in jeopardy at all.

Like GDP mentioned, everything out there is saying that Dan wanted to take the fight injured or not, but his camp is the one that convinced him to scratch the fight fight in the end. Props to Dan for attempting to gut it out. But could someone in his camp have made the call earlier?

Actually, it was the UFC doctor who said he cannot compete, not the camp.

Should someone in the camp had a UFC doctor come in sooner? Like when the injury happened, or sometime during the time where Dan wasn't able to train? Again credit to Dan for trying to fight through it. But knowing what we know know, should they have had it checked out earlier?

Do we know when the injury actually happened? I still am not sure that news is out? maybe i missed it

http://www.mmamania.com/2012/8/24/3265907/ufc-151-dan-henderson-jon-jones-vitor-belfort
"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

yeah, if it happened that far out he had to have done more. a lil blame should go on him but at the end of the day, Jones could have saved it all by accepting the Chael fight. and he chose to pussy out of the biggest payday and the easiest fight of his UFC career IMO

OU wrote:

Quote :

"Dan Henderson got hurt three weeks ago during sparring when he went to defend a takedown and for a while he has to be away from training, for two to three weeks. It was very difficult for him to refuse the fight. All the team had to convince him not to do it. We did a final sparring yesterday to evaluate his condition and he really didn't have the chance to fight with Jones. His fight has been called off and when he bounces back, he will be able to dispute the belt."

How much blame falls on Dan? Does he get credit for gutting it out or should he have given the UFC the heads up weeks ago? Mixed emotions. I don't want to hate on Dan for trying to gut it out. But hindsight is 20/20 and it could have saved the event if he would have spoken up.

good point as I just found out it was 3 weeks ago.

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

They HAVE attempted to, though. 2012 is the year of the injury.

I'll agree to that somewhat. But there have been some skimpy cards thrown out there as well. There is a major difference between some of these cards.

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

They HAVE attempted to, though. 2012 is the year of the injury.

I'll agree to that somewhat. But there have been some skimpy cards thrown out there as well. There is a major difference between some of these cards.

its time to bring in the SF roster, if they plan to put on so many cards then they need the roster to back it up

Obviously there isn't going to be any information that comes out that is going to take the majority of the blame off of Jon Jones. He is rightfully getting the bulk of the blame.

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

They HAVE attempted to, though. 2012 is the year of the injury.

I'll agree to that somewhat. But there have been some skimpy cards thrown out there as well. There is a major difference between some of these cards.

its time to bring in the SF roster, if they plan to put on so many cards then they need the roster to back it up

I wish. Let's look at the SF LHW roster. There is Mousasi and then there is....uh yeah, Mousasi. Who doesn't have a worthy opponent in sight right now since Feijao is suspended and Mo is gone. It would have been too perfect to get Mousasi in the UFC to take on Jones. His name wasn't even mentioned, I'm assuming he is stuck in SF due to Showtime.

Did you guys see the article where he responds? a lot of I I I I and ME ME ME ME riddled in with "I wasn't the one who canceled the card"

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

Ludo wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

OU wrote:

60% blame on Jones
30% blame on Greg Jackson
10% blame on Dana. It's absolutely true that if the PPV wasn't so weak, we would still have a card. The UFC has had some extremely watered down cards recently and that was a factor here.

Lets not forget that the co main event on this card got scratched because of injury as well, Kosh had to pull out cuz of injury

They raised the interesting question on mmajunkie radio yesterday right after the live conference. They asked if the event would still be going on if Kos didn't get injured? Interesting question. But this was a weak card outside of the main event, which Zuffa deserves the blame for.

with all the injuries happening and so many cards, the ufc will have to rethink their plans for the future. no way can they afford another hit like this

Hopefully they attempt to stack the cards a little more. It's been pretty bad of late.

They HAVE attempted to, though. 2012 is the year of the injury.

I'll agree to that somewhat. But there have been some skimpy cards thrown out there as well. There is a major difference between some of these cards.

its time to bring in the SF roster, if they plan to put on so many cards then they need the roster to back it up

I wish. Let's look at the SF LHW roster. There is Mousasi and then there is....uh yeah, Mousasi. Who doesn't have a worthy opponent in sight right now since Feijao is suspended and Mo is gone. It would have been too perfect to get Mousasi in the UFC to take on Jones. His name wasn't even mentioned, I'm assuming he is stuck in SF due to Showtime.

fuck, i forgot about the showtime contract they also have. feel trrrible for Mousasi

killerofchicken wrote:

Did you guys see the article where he responds? a lot of I I I I and ME ME ME ME riddled in with "I wasn't the one who canceled the card"

new thread worthy

Jones 88% then based on today's discussion. There were other factors, but his decision was the crux of the situation.

GDPofDRC wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

Did you guys see the article where he responds? a lot of I I I I and ME ME ME ME riddled in with "I wasn't the one who canceled the card"

new thread worthy

It's pretty weak.

GDPofDRC wrote:

Jones 88% then based on today's discussion. There were other factors, but his decision was the crux of the situation.

Totally agree, especially when you factor in, IMO, the fact that Chael would be a walk in the park for him and he had the UFC in the palm of his hand considering the pay

GDPofDRC wrote:

Jones 88% then based on today's discussion. There were other factors, but his decision was the crux of the situation.

I don't think you are giving Greg Jackson his fair share of the blame. Sounds like he didn't even give Jones the opportunity to consider it without telling him it was the dumbest thing he could ever do.

GDPofDRC wrote:

killerofchicken wrote:

Did you guys see the article where he responds? a lot of I I I I and ME ME ME ME riddled in with "I wasn't the one who canceled the card"

new thread worthy

damn, ill have to browse for that one... so much shit popped up on my twitter feed in the last 24 hours that it'll be a bitch finding it