THE GREAT TITLE REIGNS

marbleheadmaui wrote:

Birdofthad wrote:

+1 coming your way when i get a vote marble great read

I was hoping you would include Armstrongs, glad ya didl, it may not have been the longest reign but man he was so active it was nuts
how do you feel about Jack Johnsons 7 year reign?

I think the issue with Johnson's reign is who he didn't fight. Langford, Jeanette, McVea. Now do I think as a heavy Johnson was the best of them? Yup. Do I understand there was no money in a balck champion fighting a black challenger in those days? Yup.

But there were a series of rough customers he never fought as champ.

what if we recognize Johnsons reign as starting when he won the Colored Heavyweight Championship though? Which IMO carried more weight than Marvin Hart vs Tommy Burns

we will hunt you down 1 by 1 gumby

hahaha jk do as you plesae my droogie

marbleheadmaui wrote:

powerpuncher wrote:

marbleheadmaui wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

What about Roy Jones Jr Marble?

Well other than not being the man at either 168 or 175 you mean

i would say that its not fair to say that jones wasnt the man at 175. he held most of the belts. dariusz should never be called the man over jones.

Why not? He was the guy who actually won all the belts.

he beat virgil hill then he only fought for wbo belt after that. jones had every other belt during that time. jones was also #1 p4p so if that was the case, how would dariusz be the man at 175? if you thought that he was, you were one of the very few people who thought so.

Gumby wrote:

Is it cool if I post this at ESPN or would people have beef with that?

Please don't. I'm not willing to do work for that place.

powerpuncher wrote:

marbleheadmaui wrote:

powerpuncher wrote:

marbleheadmaui wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

What about Roy Jones Jr Marble?

Well other than not being the man at either 168 or 175 you mean

i would say that its not fair to say that jones wasnt the man at 175. he held most of the belts. dariusz should never be called the man over jones.

Why not? He was the guy who actually won all the belts.

he beat virgil hill then he only fought for wbo belt after that. jones had every other belt during that time. jones was also #1 p4p so if that was the case, how would dariusz be the man at 175? if you thought that he was, you were one of the very few people who thought so.

No Jones ONLY had belts because Darius was stripped of them. He NEVER won them from Darius.

What's the best reign of the last 5-10 yrs?

Calzaghe at 168? Pongsaklek Wonjongkam at 115? Calderon at 105/108?

Damn

gomez1012 wrote:

What's the best reign of the last 5-10 yrs?

Calzaghe at 168? Pongsaklek Wonjongkam at 115? Calderon at 105/108?

Damn

Good question. I don't think Calzaghe faced the right guys, same in someways with Wonjonkam, hmmmm....Ricky Hatton? That just can't be the right answer can it? Wlad? Geeze I dunno either.

It would have to be Wlad. He faced more ring ranked fighters at HW. Yes, it is a weak top 10, but still.

marbleheadmaui wrote:

Good question. I don't think Calzaghe faced the right guys, same in someways with Wonjonkam, hmmmm....Ricky Hatton? That just can't be the right answer can it? Wlad? Geeze I dunno either.

Yea....Hatton or Wlad.....

honestly I think if its in the last 5-10 years it would be BHops Middleweight reign even though he held a belt since the 90s

Question whos Title Reign is better

Lennox Lewis beating Rahman, Tyson, and Klitschko, or Wladimir's reign. Chris Byrd is honestly the best fighter Wlad beat during his title reign in my opinon and thats the fight that started it

Hopkins lost his crown to Taylor in 05

Lennox run at HW > Wlad's
Not even close

gomez1012 wrote:

Hopkins lost his crown to Taylor in 05

Lennox run at HW > Wlad's
Not even close

the question was in the last 5-10 years

IDK if anyone has better wins than Tito, a bloated Oscar, and the Morrade Hokkar's in this time period

I think BHOP's reign is better than respectable. I left him off only becaue I think the 20 defenses thingy is just crap. He had 6-7 as THE MAN.

But he clearly cleaned out the division and deserves huge kudos for that.


I agree, the 20 defenses thing is B.S. same goes for Joe Calzaghe. Thanks for your work !

Chavez had a great title run from 130 to 140.

powerpuncher wrote:

marbleheadmaui wrote:

powerpuncher wrote:

marbleheadmaui wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

What about Roy Jones Jr Marble?

Well other than not being the man at either 168 or 175 you mean

i would say that its not fair to say that jones wasnt the man at 175. he held most of the belts. dariusz should never be called the man over jones.

Why not? He was the guy who actually won all the belts.

he beat virgil hill then he only fought for wbo belt after that. jones had every other belt during that time. jones was also #1 p4p so if that was the case, how would dariusz be the man at 175? if you thought that he was, you were one of the very few people who thought so.

Count me and several million non-american fans among those who thought Darius was the man. In fact, ONLY in the borders of the USA was Jones ever considered the man. Everywhere else they recognized the lineal and TRUE champion, who won the title in the RING and never lost it, Darius Michalzewski.

Virgill Hill (WBA champion) flew to Germany to fight Henry Maske (IBF champion). Hill won the fight and both belts. Darius Michalzewski (WBO 190 AND 175 champion) fought and dominated Virgil Hill to take the WBO, WBA, and IBF belts. He would then add the WBC title by defeating Gracciano Gochigiani. (Rochigianni would win a lawsuit that bankrupted the WBC when Suliaman took the belt BACK and gave it to Jones without benefit of actually making Jones fight for it!?!?)

You old ESPN guys KNEW I would not let this one go LOL!!!!

I was privy to a large portion of Roy Jones career and negotiations. one of those fights, was with Darius Michalzewski. There is NO other way to put it but this, Roy Jones Jr. killed that fight on PURPOSE and wih DELIBERATE intent. Over the year, both camps would make insincere offers to the other as publicity stunts or outright lie about what they did or did not offer the other fighter. Truth was, both guys were making bank (Michalzewski was making MORE than Jones per fight until Jones heavyweight days). Both guys were dominating the same level of competition (and often the same competition, and both were comfortable doing so.
There was only ever ONE serious offer for the fight, the very first one, and it was scuttled and killed by Jones. In that fight Universum offered Jones a fight in Germany for 5 million and a portion of the gate + all the USA PPV money. (it would have been the Biggest payday of Jones career and remained so until very late in Jones fistic career). HBO wanted the fight. Jones said he would not fight in Germany. Darius and Universum agreed to come to Las Vegas for the fight even though the fight would make significantly MORE money in Germany where Darius could sell-out soccer areneas while Jones was posting the worst viewership numbers in the history of HBO boxing. Jones agreed to the Las Vegas fight but wanted a larger up front guarantee. Universum balked, but Lou Dibella (then head of HBO boxing) wanted the fight badly and opened up the HBO checkbook to make Jone happy. Jones then said he wanted a portion of the over-seas PPV money and Universum agreed on the condition that Darius get an equal share of the US money. Joes said no. DiBella again saved the fight by giving Darius more "up-front" money (and is rumored to have given Universum time-slots for a boxing show. Universum has made this claim and HBO has denied it) the fight was again saved. Jone then demanded a portion of the PPV over seas again, and this time Universum and Darius said he could have a small percentege. Jone said it wasnt "enough" and walked away from the table prompting Lou DiBella to make his first and ONLY public chastisement of an HBO fighter when he called Jones "Difficult to the point of delusional" at the negotiating table.
(He would later talk about how CRAZY Samuel Peter was and how he practically assaulted Lou during dinner, but only after he had left HBO).

Here are some other little Jones/Michalzewski facts and tidbits.

Roy Jones became so angry at Larry Merchant for constantly asking him about when he would fight Darius Michalzewski that he tried to have his contract altered to ban the mention of Darius Michalzewski's name during the broadcast of any of his fights. (HBO refused of course)

Eddie Futch (who trained Montell Griffin for both Roy Jones and Darius Michalzewski) said that "Jones dont want NONE of what that Darius has". He picked Darius to TKO Jones if they ever fought. (Eddie also famously predicted Douglas over Tyson, Randall over Chavez, and McCall over Lewis)

Roy Jones turned down a fight with Nigel Benn in favor of Bryant Brannon.

Jones also had a "roundtable" discussion live on HBO in which he claimed to have made an offer to many fighters including Frankie Liles (who TKO'd him as an amateur an fought him to a pair of razor thin decisons) which was never [i]actually made. Liles woud fight Jones TODAY if he could. That was the one fight Liles wanted above all others his whole career.

Darius Michalzewski almost fought Antonio Tarver but Tarver was unavailable because of a nagging back injury. KaDy King got the fight instead.

forgot to add that Steve Farhood of RING Magazine has publically stated that they made a mistake when they installed Roy Jones as the 175 pound champion in thier inagural rankings. "It should have been Michalzeski, we made a mistake".

haha. good old boxing lawyer and his hatred towards jones.

either way, jones was #1 p4p and dariusz was really nothing outside of germany. then he lost to gonzales and it was over for him.

I don't know any of the business that took place between Jones/Michalzewski and the two camps, however I've known BL and his threads to be mostly accurate. My question would be, if HBO wanted this fight so bad, why wouldn't they try and get Michalzewski under some kind of contract?

4445Frank wrote:

My question would be, if HBO wanted this fight so bad, why wouldn't they try and get Michalzewski under some kind of contract?

The Iron Hand of Universum.

He was making far more money in Germany than he would have in the states. He was virtually unknown here so HBO couldn't justify paying him eleventy billion to fight here.

KrazyHorseBennett wrote:

4445Frank wrote:

My question would be, if HBO wanted this fight so bad, why wouldn't they try and get Michalzewski under some kind of contract?

The Iron Hand of Universum.

He was making far more money in Germany than he would have in the states. He was virtually unknown here so HBO couldn't justify paying him eleventy billion to fight here.

Gotcha.

Correct. Darius was as big a draw in Europe as the klitshcko's are now. Attendance for his fights was routinly triple what Joes brought in. Universum had a great cash cow and knew it. HBO could not sign him because he was in an iron-clad contract all ready.

Also, to the joker who mentioned Gonzalez. That loss for Darius (who is OLDER than Jones and always had a "contact" mentality in his career) took place the same time as Jones was getting owned by Tarver. Jones and Michalzewski had parallel primes. Darius was earlier to the scene than Jones by a few months and suffered his first loss a few months before Jones. Unlike Jones, it only took one 16 month retirement an failed comeback to convince DM he was done. Again, when you look at the 175 body of work for both guys, its almost identical. For some reason, US fans want to give jones a ton of credit for his and ignore Darius for his. Its just does not make sense to me. Either both were great or niether was.

Amen, BL. Couldn't have said it better myself. You can't talk sense with the American-centric crowd.

Canvas wrote:

Amen, BL. Couldn't have said it better myself. You can't talk sense with the American-centric crowd.

Hell, I'm American and I believe it.

4445Frank wrote:

Canvas wrote:

Amen, BL. Couldn't have said it better myself. You can't talk sense with the American-centric crowd.

Hell, I'm American and I believe it.

As do I.

Although I guess that wouldn't make us American-centric then. It would make us sensible Americans.

boxinglawyer wrote:

Correct. Darius was as big a draw in Europe as the klitshcko's are now. Attendance for his fights was routinly triple what Joes brought in. Universum had a great cash cow and knew it. HBO could not sign him because he was in an iron-clad contract all ready.

Also, to the joker who mentioned Gonzalez. That loss for Darius (who is OLDER than Jones and always had a "contact" mentality in his career) took place the same time as Jones was getting owned by Tarver. Jones and Michalzewski had parallel primes. Darius was earlier to the scene than Jones by a few months and suffered his first loss a few months before Jones. Unlike Jones, it only took one 16 month retirement an failed comeback to convince DM he was done. Again, when you look at the 175 body of work for both guys, its almost identical. For some reason, US fans want to give jones a ton of credit for his and ignore Darius for his. Its just does not make sense to me. Either both were great or niether was.

who are you calling a joker?

i think the main reason for jones' loss to tarver was his weight drain. he still beat tarver in their first fight though. also, jones did fight better competition. they fought some of the same fighters but jones fought some fighters that dariusz never fought that were ranked opponents. jones would have never lost to gonzales.