UFC HW Division vs. Strikeforce HW Division

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

Thats cause you're crazy, Cain has wrestled larger guys his entire career, he was also a HW D-1 wrestler(Arizona State). Brock is quick but Cain is quicker. Randy held his own just fine wrestling with Brock until he got clipped in the back of the head and lost his senses he was doing great. Cain is bigger and stronger then Randy he should hold his own fine when it comes to wrestling. Cain has better boxing and a speed advantage.

I smell another Sig bet.

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

Is this going to be a problem for MMA? What I mean is that is it going to end up like boxing were you cant get the best guys to fight each other because of who promotes them? BTW I say the UFC because of Brock.

Why do you pick the UFC just because of the 4th best HW in MMA? ha ha... I don't want to get into that though.

LOL Do you really think he is the 4th best? Who do you have above him? Just a question I am not one of those Brocktards.

Right now I'd pick Fedor, Reem and Cain to beat him. I think the Brock train comes back to reality soon. Not saying he isn't good but he isn't as good as most people seem to think he is...IMO

Cain? Really? I see how people can say Fedor and I am still not sure about Reem either but I also have not seen him fight a lot. Man I see this being a problem in the future for MMA just like it is right now in boxing.

Cain has more MMA fights, more wins in the UFC, never been beaten, beating Nog is arguably as impressive as anything Brock has done. He is younger, closer to his wrestling prime and seems to have great cardio.

Cain beating Big Nog in 2010 is not more impressive than Brock beating Carwin, Mir and a number 2 ranked Randy Couture.

soonermark890 wrote:

Is this going to be a problem for MMA? What I mean is that is it going to end up like boxing were you cant get the best guys to fight each other because of who promotes them? BTW I say the UFC because of Brock.

It already is a problem, and has been a problem since Pride. And don't leave Bellator out of the mix, guys like Warrern, Alvarez, and Askren will have major claims to the top spot in the near future.

Brock has only manhandled fighters with awful wrestling. Cain is a way better wrestler. Sure, maybe a college age Brock could have beaten Cain, but that was so long ago Cain has to get the on paper wrestling advantage.

On paper, and I mean really on paper, if you know how to read what the paper says, Brock is an underdog against Cain.

That's never been a "problem" for me.

Wolfgangsta wrote:

tolivendiewithLA wrote:

With SF adding another talented HW to the mix I thought this would be a good poll. Don't look at it really from a resume perspective, simply talent level.

UFC:

Brock
Cain
Dos Santos
Carwin
Nelson
Nog
Mir
Cro cop
Rothwell
Barry
Kongo
Gonzo
Struve

SF:

Fedor
Reem
Werdum
Barnett
Big Foot
AA
Cormier
Del Rosario
Rogers

You're forgetting Lashley, Brandon Cash, Lolohea Mahe, but especially Lavar Johnson who headlines events.

Kharitonov as well.

UFC has Mark Hunt. Disband this website now.

captain organic wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

Is this going to be a problem for MMA? What I mean is that is it going to end up like boxing were you cant get the best guys to fight each other because of who promotes them? BTW I say the UFC because of Brock.

It already is a problem, and has been a problem since Pride. And don't leave Bellator out of the mix, guys like Warrern, Alvarez, and Askren will have major claims to the top spot in the near future.

Combat sports in general are going to be in trouble if they dont get their crap together and fast.

Wolfgangsta wrote:

Brock has only manhandled fighters with awful wrestling. Cain is a way better wrestler. Sure, maybe a college age Brock could have beaten Cain, but that was so long ago Cain has to get the on paper wrestling advantage.

On paper, and I mean really on paper, if you know how to read what the paper says, Brock is an underdog against Cain.

Carwin had awful wrestling? My point is once Brock takes Cain down its over. This is going to be a really fun fight isnt it?

soonermark890 wrote:

Wolfgangsta wrote:

Brock has only manhandled fighters with awful wrestling. Cain is a way better wrestler. Sure, maybe a college age Brock could have beaten Cain, but that was so long ago Cain has to get the on paper wrestling advantage.

On paper, and I mean really on paper, if you know how to read what the paper says, Brock is an underdog against Cain.

Carwin had awful wrestling? My point is once Brock takes Cain down its over. This is going to be a really fun fight isnt it?

When you say over, do mean like the 19 seconds total Brock was able to keep Randy down after managing to take him down twice?

GDPofDRC wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

Wolfgangsta wrote:

Brock has only manhandled fighters with awful wrestling. Cain is a way better wrestler. Sure, maybe a college age Brock could have beaten Cain, but that was so long ago Cain has to get the on paper wrestling advantage.

On paper, and I mean really on paper, if you know how to read what the paper says, Brock is an underdog against Cain.

Carwin had awful wrestling? My point is once Brock takes Cain down its over. This is going to be a really fun fight isnt it?

When you say over, do mean like the 19 seconds total Brock was able to keep Randy down after managing to take him down twice?

I mean Brock will not let him up and he will pound him out or sub him. Now dont get me wrong he would have to take him down early in the round to be able to do that. But I just see brock manhandling Cain. I could be wrong you guys know more than I do.

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

I will simplify this down to the fighters worth a shit in bold:

UFC:

Brock
Cain
Dos Santos
Carwin
Nelson
Nog
Mir
Cro cop
Rothwell - He is like Mr. Hang around guy
Barry - Eventually he might be worth making bold
Kongo - No fucking way
Gonzo - He has the tools, but great inconsistency
Struve - I like him, I really do, he just doesn't have the weight

SF:

Fedor
Reem
Werdum
Barnett - He looked real good beating up a nobody in Australia, plus he has failed three test
Big Foot - I have never been greatly impressed by him
AA - Big name, no chin
Cormier - I like him, but he still has a way to go
Del Rosario
Rogers - He has already been outed

bwahahha holy shit GDP the guy got his mask knocked off his face hahaha

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

GDP, first off I love the Sig. But you are comparing Cain's wrestling ability and experience to Randy's? Really? Whatever your are toking, start sharing.

I take Cain's over Randy's today or any time since 2008. Easy. MMA or a wrestling match.

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

For two reasons IMO.
1. Cain is no Randy
2. Brock has improved

I'm going Mr. Stat Guy and judging according to my sheet...

Top-5:
UFC-3 (Lesnar, Cain, JDS)
SF-2 (Werdum, Fedor)

Edge - UFC

Top-10:
UFC-3 (Carwin, Nog, Mir)
SF-2 (Reem, Barnett)

Edge - UFC

Top-25:
UFC-6 (CroCop, Gonzaga, Kongo, Nelson, Rothwell, Russow)
SF-3 (Rogers, Bigfoot, AA)

Edge - UFC

Depth and up and coming talent:

UFC (Barry, Struve, Yvel, Beltran, Schaub, Tuchscherer)
SF (Cormier, del Rosario)

Edge - UFC

A UFC sweep means I must vote that way... But damn it's getting closer.

Cain is no Randy for sure. He is a faster, stronger, in better shape, less worn version of Randy with better striking.

soonermark890 wrote:

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

For two reasons IMO.
1. Cain is no Randy
2. Brock has improved

You really think that since Brock subbed a gassed out Carwin that he can sub Cain? Not gonna happen, don't let that weak ass arm triangle fool you, Cain won't go out like that. You think too highly of Brock, he won't be able to hold down Cain even if he does somehow manage to get him down. This thing goes into the later rounds and Brock is in a world of trouble.

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

For two reasons IMO.
1. Cain is no Randy
2. Brock has improved

You really think that since Brock subbed a gassed out Carwin that he can sub Cain? Not gonna happen, don't let that weak ass arm triangle fool you, Cain won't go out like that. You think too highly of Brock, he won't be able to hold down Cain even if he does somehow manage to get him down. This thing goes into the later rounds and Brock is in a world of trouble.

sniff sniff I smell a bet coming on.

soonermark890 wrote:

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

For two reasons IMO.
1. Cain is no Randy
2. Brock has improved

You really think that since Brock subbed a gassed out Carwin that he can sub Cain? Not gonna happen, don't let that weak ass arm triangle fool you, Cain won't go out like that. You think too highly of Brock, he won't be able to hold down Cain even if he does somehow manage to get him down. This thing goes into the later rounds and Brock is in a world of trouble.

sniff sniff I smell a bet coming on.

I see an eye opening experience for you coming up. You are going to learn a lesson the hard way like all those FSU fans did this weekend ha ha.

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

GDPofDRC wrote:

But why do you think Brock can keep him down when he couldn't keep Randy down for longer than a few seconds both times. Why do think that Lesnar will be able to get GNP good enough to finish Cain when he has never GNP'd any wrestler who had even a little skill? I don't get that.

For two reasons IMO.
1. Cain is no Randy
2. Brock has improved

You really think that since Brock subbed a gassed out Carwin that he can sub Cain? Not gonna happen, don't let that weak ass arm triangle fool you, Cain won't go out like that. You think too highly of Brock, he won't be able to hold down Cain even if he does somehow manage to get him down. This thing goes into the later rounds and Brock is in a world of trouble.

sniff sniff I smell a bet coming on.

I see an eye opening experience for you coming up. You are going to learn a lesson the hard way like all those FSU fans did this weekend ha ha.

I just remember all those people talking crap to me before he fought Randy, Then it was Mir, Then it was Carwin, Now its Cain. I guess maybe some day you guys will be right but I dont think it will be Cain.

All I know is I can't wait to hear what the excuses will be if Brock wins again. I hope Mazzagoti is the ref, just so there will be some weight behind your anti-Brock stances. I mean I think the guy is an asshole for what he did at UFC 100, but Sooners and Wolf hated the guy before he even stepped into the Octogon.

Andrew, why would you want Mazzy as the ref? Borck wouldn't still be wearing the belt if Mazzy was reffing the Carwin fight...