Jack Johnson vs. Sonny Liston

Jack London has given up his quest to find a “Great White Hope.” The spit that landed on his face, courtesy of Jack Johnson’s perfect aim from the ring to his face, has him blinded with rage. He’s discovered what he thinks is some kind of freak of nature. A power savant of some kind. A mutant of manpower. Sure, Sonny Liston’s on the chain gain, but with the help of a few calls, London gets him off and makes him promise to stop beating on cops, at least for the next two years. Sonny complies and London requests the training services of one “Mr. Blackburn.” Sonny learns fast in those two years and is feared by even the greatest of gladiators. There is no chance of him getting a fight with a white fighter, however his wins over Sam Langford and removing the teeth of one Joe Jeanette with a single jab catches the eye of Johnson.

Johnson, though not crazy about the fight, realizes that Sonny has become a bit of an anomaly, a side show of terrifying power, who is being shown in carnivals and black boxing shows all over the country. The fight is made and is scheduled for 45 rounds. You call the action.

The 45 rounds is the hard part. Part of me says it doesn't matter.

Sonny paces himself like it is a 15 rounder, uses his TEN inch reach advantage to jab, jab, jab and gets Lil Arthur out of there. If Choyinski could knock him out and Ketchell knock him down, Sonny certainly has enough pop to finish him.

But the other part thinks Johnson was much stronger mentally and he probably could frustrate Sonny into making mistakes by grabbing him, holding, cheap shotting etc and taking him into the 30th round and then jumping on him.

Gotta think about this one.

this is a case of who i consider the greater fighter in johnson losing to liston the fighter not as great as johnson.providing it be a 15 round fight..the reason i say 15 is because thats the championship distance i knew but it was different back then..10 20 45 rounds or any number inbetween was the case..johnson realizes early on liston has too many advantages for him to maybe overcome including power to more than keep him honest..johnson then pulls a eddie machen by using defence footwork grabing clutching and holding to survive but his counterpunching makes it effective to keep him in the game..sonny does not get out of his game plan nor does he get frustrated and does more via body shots and efective agression to win a 15 rd UD..
now the topic stated 45 rounds..johnson continues doing this for several more rounds and is used to fighting by holding pushing grabing well beyound the 15 rounds.liston is not.around 22 or so liston is started to slow time and get tired considerably..4 or 5 rounds later after johnson had open season on sonny he doesnt anser the bell for round 28..fully exausted sonny has no more to give..thats what my immagination tells me anyway..not bad for a person who is not a fan of dream fights i guess.

no clue

but Im sure of this

Fuck Jack London

Birdofthad wrote:

no clue

but Im sure of this

Fuck Jack London

Why? He was a man of his time. The world is a richer place for having Call of the Wild, White Fang etc in our canon of literature.

Do you F Washington and Jefferson for owning slaves? F FDR for imprisoning thousands of Amercian citizens?

see Im not a big believer of "Man of Times"

ya alotta people were racist, but tehre were also alot of progressive people that were for human rights

London wasnt one of em

sorry if you right stuff like

"Oh please Jim come remove the smile from this niggers face" I wont be a fan of you

FDR on the other hand had to do something cause like it or not american citizens played a roll in the attack on Pearl Harbor knowing or unknowingly they did.

Theres a difference between 1812 and 1910 IMO

should we say the 1960's Klan movement were just men of their times?

there was a article published here in the Dallas Morning News last weekend talking about how far texas has come, THe Texas State Fair in the 1920's had an annual Ku Klux Klan day and the largest Klan chapter in america was Dallas' over 16,000 members.

They controlled city council, governor's all that shit you had to be a Klansmen to get elected, they would go to local hotels and grab black men and do whatever they pleased. until the Dallas Morning News took a anti Klan stance in the 20's, by 1929 Texas had their first woman senator or governor cant remember (and she was anti Klan) and by the 30's the Klan here had all but disbanded (under 1,300 members). Writing is a powerful tool and London used it to set races back IMO

I hold the old timers that fought for equality in high reguard , not the ones that were simple minded and racist.

still Call of the Wild was good



http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/125th/newsevents/stories/051410dnmetkkk125th.2dd6965.html

I understand Im kinda gerrymandering since Ive gone from London to the Klan, but my point is writing makes a difference, London was a big time writer, he influenced alot of people and he should be held accountable

I also despise Woodrow Wilson (who my high school was named after) for allowing the first movie viewed in the white house to be "The Birth of a Nation" which depicted blacks as animals that wanted to rape white women, to which Wilson said the movie was "accurate"

Bet he's rolling in his grave knowing a 90 % minority high school is named after him in the south

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/utilities/clickedimage/index.html

link to the pic i was trying to post

Birdofthad wrote:

see Im not a big believer of "Man of Times"

ya alotta people were racist, but tehre were also alot of progressive people that were for human rights

London wasnt one of em

sorry if you right stuff like

"Oh please Jim come remove the smile from this niggers face" I wont be a fan of you

FDR on the other hand had to do something cause like it or not american citizens played a roll in the attack on Pearl Harbor knowing or unknowingly they did.

Theres a difference between 1812 and 1910 IMO

should we say the 1960's Klan movement were just men of their times?

there was a article published here in the Dallas Morning News last weekend talking about how far texas has come, THe Texas State Fair in the 1920's had an annual Ku Klux Klan day and the largest Klan chapter in america was Dallas' over 16,000 members.

They controlled city council, governor's all that shit you had to be a Klansmen to get elected, they would go to local hotels and grab black men and do whatever they pleased. until the Dallas Morning News took a anti Klan stance in the 20's, by 1929 Texas had their first woman senator or governor cant remember (and she was anti Klan) and by the 30's the Klan here had all but disbanded (under 1,300 members). Writing is a powerful tool and London used it to set races back IMO

I hold the old timers that fought for equality in high reguard , not the ones that were simple minded and racist.

still Call of the Wild was good



http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/localnews/125th/newsevents/stories/051410dnmetkkk125th.2dd6965.html

I understand Im kinda gerrymandering since Ive gone from London to the Klan, but my point is writing makes a difference, London was a big time writer, he influenced alot of people and he should be held accountable

I also despise Woodrow Wilson (who my high school was named after) for allowing the first movie viewed in the white house to be "The Birth of a Nation" which depicted blacks as animals that wanted to rape white women, to which Wilson said the movie was "accurate"

Bet he's rolling in his grave knowing a 90 % minority high school is named after him in the south

The question in my mind is if the belief is common for the time and place? I have no big issue with a man not being heroic as London wasn't.

By the 1960's the armed forces had been integrated, Jackie Robinson and Joe Louis had happened, Brown Vs. Board was law etc. A VERY different situation.

Judging people of history by the values of today seems silly to me. The question ought to be were they out of touch/behind their own times? The Klansman of the 1960's clearly were, Jack London clearly was not. Fer crying out loud London was DEAD by WWI. You can hardly blame 1920's and 1930's Texas attitudes on him.

Giving FDR a pass btw is utterly indefensible given your other views. There is not a SHRED of evidence US citizens on the mainland contributed in ANY way to the Pearl Harbor attack.

also gotta remember Im a 22 year old more left than right Texan so Im known to say brash things like Fuck Jack London



also have to keep in mind i talk with a grandfather that did 3 tours in Korea and is convinced FDR let alot of traitors off the hook

but as always good points marble, your probably right on FDr
my point is we know for a fact Japanese military was calling japanese americans and asking how the weather was and stuff like that

we couldnt have that happen again

dark stain on FDr, ya, but like you said, was it right for the times, and in the time of a Tojo Japan and a Hitler Germany we did some things that wouldnt fly know and we probably shouldnt have then

Birdofthad wrote:

also gotta remember Im a 22 year old more left than right Texan so Im known to say brash things like Fuck Jack London



also have to keep in mind i talk with a grandfather that did 3 tours in Korea and is convinced FDR let alot of traitors off the hook

LOL on point one. I understand, I was once 22...I think

FDR absolutely did let traitors off the hook. Joe Kennedy for example (not that I'm biased against that slug or anyhting) But they weren't the Americans sent to those camps. BTW, FDR was dead six years before the Korean War...just sayin!

also gotta remember, it was congress calling the Japanese the "achilles heel of our nation" and the Attorney General refering to them as "enemy aliens" that pressured FDR into rounding up 120,000 of them

he didnt just do it out of no where

I think FDR was gonna win election after election until he died, just like he did

Hey nothing wrong with making money of prohibition (wink)

and Im pretty positive they have proof that Japanese military was calling local Japanese Hawaaii'n residince before Pearl Harbor

Birdofthad wrote:

and Im pretty positive they have proof that Japanese military was calling local Japanese Hawaaii'n residince before Pearl Harbor

Yup. But that doesn't explain the 100,000+ people on the mainland.

how many people actualy had phones back then..and a private phone number was rare.it was mostly party lines..party line means 5 different people with different phone numbers shared the same service line and if one was talking on the phone you1.could hear there conversation and 2. you could not get a incoming call nor make an outgoing one untill the line was free..its more than likely that phone story is a bogus rumor..