troops in yemen and Libya !

Cu Bu wrote:

captain organic wrote:

Cu Bu wrote:

Birdofthad wrote:

I have stated nothing but facts

i linked abc and yahoo not exactly fox or drudge on my info

you really do not think al qaeda militants were among the rebels in Libya? We indirectly gave them over 7,000 hand held surface to air missle launchers by not being on the ground when momar fell

Is there any evidence that AQ were amongst the rebels? If not, why try and guess?

And those rebels taking those weapons is so much different then the US giving those weapons to the rebels.


A real shakey argument u r trying to build here.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8407047/Libyan-rebel-commander-admits-his-fighters-have-al-Qaeda-links.html

http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-liberation-of-libya-nato-special-forces-and-al-qaeda-join-hands/26255

http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/30/al-qaeda-sends-fighters-to-libya/

http://www.examiner.com/article/anti-al-qaeda-libyans-reveal-obama-administration-helped-al-qaeda-benghazi

Libya is completely different then Yemen and Syria, Libya ha a much more organized national from comman council THAT HAS NO TIES TO AL QAEDA, we funded them, there's a difference between funding n army and organizing al Qaeda

Remember all those long conversations Peggy and I have had over Reagan, afghansotan and the CIA?

Stop attempting to claim we dropped 7,000 surface to air missiles to al Qaeda , it's insulting on this weekend

Libyan Fighting Group formed out Of Libyan Islamic Fight Group, one of their commanders has admitted to fighting us in afghanistan, One of their leaders commands the assault on tripoli, they however has small level Toledo. The Nation Transitory Council or the NTC who was running the country's d army

Birdofthad wrote:

Cu Bu wrote:

captain organic wrote:

Cu Bu wrote:

Birdofthad wrote:

I have stated nothing but facts

i linked abc and yahoo not exactly fox or drudge on my info

you really do not think al qaeda militants were among the rebels in Libya? We indirectly gave them over 7,000 hand held surface to air missle launchers by not being on the ground when momar fell

Is there any evidence that AQ were amongst the rebels? If not, why try and guess?

And those rebels taking those weapons is so much different then the US giving those weapons to the rebels.


A real shakey argument u r trying to build here.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/libya/8407047/Libyan-rebel-commander-admits-his-fighters-have-al-Qaeda-links.html

http://www.globalresearch.ca/the-liberation-of-libya-nato-special-forces-and-al-qaeda-join-hands/26255

http://security.blogs.cnn.com/2011/12/30/al-qaeda-sends-fighters-to-libya/

http://www.examiner.com/article/anti-al-qaeda-libyans-reveal-obama-administration-helped-al-qaeda-benghazi

Libya is completely different then Yemen and Syria, Libya ha a much more organized national from comman council THAT HAS NO TIES TO AL QAEDA, we funded them, there's a difference between funding n army and organizing al Qaeda

Remember all those long conversations Peggy and I have had over Reagan, afghansotan and the CIA?

Stop attempting to claim we dropped 7,000 surface to air missiles to al Qaeda , it's insulting on this weekend

first off read my posts, I said it was action taken too late, as far as the 7,000 missles they are gone can you tell me where they are? Also don't speak of what you know nothing about in regards to veterans day Its insulting.

As always you require proof but when given some you revert back to bush or reagan.

captain organic wrote:

aight, little egg on face here. Need to figure out a rebuttal.

hey props to you for soaking it in. I am not trying to throw egg though, i like the truth no matter whom it benefits.

There's a difference between arming the NTC and Mujahideen and arming Al Qaeda

Cubes my buddyi also think your a bit confused, there were over 20,000 surface to air missiles in the country when the war started, the outposts were raided and we started a buy back program in 2011 so your wrong claiming we gave AQ 7,000 surface to air missiles

http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14610199

Ya gotta realize that most of these jihadist but jobs originally started out railing against their secular/monarchist governments (Egypt, Syria, Jordan, Saudi Arabia). These governments normally took these islamists and directed them towards Israel, then Afghanistan (to fight the Soviets) .
After the soviet war the foreign mujihadeen splintered into various groups and either directed their attacks at Israel or the USA (al Qaeda was the one to do this) while the afghan muj fought a civil war.
I feel that the Arab spring has clearly redirected Islamist terrorist back to their own governments and are attempting to fill the power vacuum. As bad as Assad is, Al Nisrah with chemical weapons is worst, I feel that Libya was justified as there was a more organized resistance fighti a weaker despot. Seriously, a no fly zone will make little difference insyria everyone has generally admitted that. I wonder if this is leveling the playing field in Afghanistan because instead of having thousands flooding in for the fighting season from Syria, Iran and Pakistan they are digging in Syria and Libya .

Is there al Qaeda in Libya, Syria and Yemen? Without a doubt, have they otter weapons and are they coordinating with anti regime forces? In some cases yes, in Syria they are actively using suicide bombers , one less martyr we have to worry about. Let Syria have their civil war and don't jump in unless chemical weapon stocks are Being moved or threatened. We are already in a military build up for Iran, which hypothetically could pull Russia and china into a war (I doubt it) but could more realistically pull Lebanon and syria into the Iran war (obviously with Israel and turkey with us)

Birdofthad wrote:

Cubes my buddyi also think your a bit confused, there were over 20,000 surface to air missiles in the country when the war started, the outposts were raided and we started a buy back program in 2011 so your wrong claiming we gave AQ 7,000 surface to air missiles

http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14610199

this is your article link in full

The White House announced today it planned to expand a program to secure and destroy Libya's huge stockpile of dangerous surface-to-air missiles, following an ABC News report that large numbers of them continue to be stolen from unguarded military warehouses.

Currently the U.S. State Department has one official on the ground in Libya, as well as five contractors who specialize in "explosive ordinance disposal", all working with the rebel Transitional National Council to find the looted missiles, White House spokesperson Jay Carney told reporters.

"We expect to deploy additional personnel to assist the TNC as they expand efforts to secure conventional arms storage sites," Carney said. "We're obviously at a governmental level -- both State Department and at the U.N. and elsewhere -- working with the TNC on this."

ABC News reported today U.S. officials and security experts were concerned some of the thousands of heat-seeking missiles could easily end up in the hands of al Qaeda or other terrorists groups, creating a threat to commercial airliners.

"Matching up a terrorist with a shoulder-fired missile, that's our worst nightmare," said Sen. Barbara Boxer, D.-California, a member of the Senate's Commerce, Energy and Transportation Committee.
Though Libya had an estimated 20,000 man-portable surface-to-air missiles before the popular uprising began in February, Assistant Secretary of State Andrew Shapiro told ABC News today the government does not have a clear picture of how many missiles they're trying to track down.

"We're making great progress and we expect in the coming days and weeks we will have a much greater picture of how many are missing," Shapiro said.

The missiles, four to six-feet long and Russian-made, can weigh just 55 pounds with launcher. They lock on to the heat generated by the engines of aircraft, can be fired from a vehicle or from a combatant's shoulder, and are accurate and deadly at a range of more than two miles.
Peter Bouckaert of Human Rights Watch first warned about the problem after a trip to Libya six months ago. He took pictures of pickup truckloads of the missiles being carted off during another trip just a few weeks ago.

"I myself could have removed several hundred if I wanted to, and people can literally drive up with pickup trucks or even 18 wheelers and take away whatever they want," said Bouckaert, HRW's emergencies director. "Every time I arrive at one of these weapons facilities, the first thing we notice going missing is the surface-to-air missiles.


this is from an administration friendly news source birdman who is confused ???

Yes your right but notice the article says those thousands of heat sealing missiles WERE ALEEADY IN THR COUNTRY WE DIDNT SUPPLY THEM

Your clearly confused as you suggest we gave al Qaeda those weapons

Birdofthad wrote:

Yes your right but notice the article says those thousands of heat sealing missiles WERE ALEEADY IN THR COUNTRY WE DIDNT SUPPLY THEM

Your clearly confused as you suggest we gave al Qaeda those weapons

we indirectly gave Al Qaeda weapons by not having FO units on the ground to assist in strikes on the depots.

did you not read any of my posts????

aight, back in.

Agree with bird in that we didn't "give AQ" those weapons. We played a part, a relatively small one, in taking down a dictator who was killing his own people in mass, which enabled AQ to get in on weaponry that they were snagging even before Gaddafi went down.

One might argue semantics, but I think it's more about portraying the situation honestly.

captain organic wrote:

aight, back in.

Agree with bird in that we didn't "give AQ" those weapons. We played a part, a relatively small one, in taking down a dictator who was killing his own people in mass, which enabled AQ to get in on weaponry that they were snagging even before Gaddafi went down.

One might argue semantics, but I think it's more about portraying the situation honestly.

ok i will strike with you since bird is still studying what i gave to him

are you aware of the mass killings in sirte after Gaddafi was killed? the rounded up people of sirte into local hotels and massacred them just for being from the same place as momar.

We had alot to do with the amount of weapons gone missing. FOX units would have been able to call munitions on the depots with little loss of life. If that was not going to happen then we had to atleast have forces on ground to stop the pilfering of missiles and other weapons.

bird obviously concedes so capt do you not agree the mismanagement of this situation could have serious repercussions?

Cu Bu wrote:

bird obviously concedes so capt do you not agree the mismanagement of this situation could have serious repercussions?

Obviously anything that goes on in the mideast has potential for serious repercussions. And given that everything over there is so twisted, where helping remove one faction guilty of mass killings is rewarded by empowering another faction who goes on to similar crimes, it prob is better to just stay out.

I was in on this when Ron Paul was pushing this notion. Though it seems very few who have access to high level intel agree.

captain organic wrote:

Cu Bu wrote:

bird obviously concedes so capt do you not agree the mismanagement of this situation could have serious repercussions?

Obviously anything that goes on in the mideast has potential for serious repercussions. And given that everything over there is so twisted, where helping remove one faction guilty of mass killings is rewarded by empowering another faction who goes on to similar crimes, it prob is better to just stay out.

I was in on this when Ron Paul was pushing this notion. Though it seems very few who have access to high level intel agree.

nice points

We essentially gave AQ the surface to air missles by using strikes and allowing them to raid the Libyan armories . Just one missle finds a commercial liner in its sights and its another game changer.

Cu Bu wrote:

Birdofthad wrote:

Cubes my buddyi also think your a bit confused, there were over 20,000 surface to air missiles in the country when the war started, the outposts were raided and we started a buy back program in 2011 so your wrong claiming we gave AQ 7,000 surface to air missiles

http://abcnews.go.com/m/story?id=14610199

this is your article link in full

The White House announced today it planned to expand a program to secure and destroy Libya's huge stockpile of dangerous surface-to-air missiles, following an ABC News report that large numbers of them continue to be stolen from unguarded military warehouses.

Currently the U.S. State Department has one official on the ground in Libya, as well as five contractors who specialize in "explosive ordinance disposal", all working with the rebel Transitional National Council to find the looted missiles, White House spokesperson Jay Carney told reporters.

"We expect to deploy additional personnel to assist the TNC as they expand efforts to secure conventional arms storage sites," Carney said. "We're obviously at a governmental level -- both State Department and at the U.N. and elsewhere -- working with the TNC on this."

ABC News reported today U.S. officials and security experts were concerned some of the thousands of heat-seeking missiles could easily end up in the hands of al Qaeda or other terrorists groups, creating a threat to commercial airliners.

"Matching up a terrorist with a shoulder-fired missile, that's our worst nightmare," said Sen. Barbara Boxer, D.-California, a member of the Senate's Commerce, Energy and Transportation Committee.
Though Libya had an estimated 20,000 man-portable surface-to-air missiles before the popular uprising began in February, Assistant Secretary of State Andrew Shapiro told ABC News today the government does not have a clear picture of how many missiles they're trying to track down.

"We're making great progress and we expect in the coming days and weeks we will have a much greater picture of how many are missing," Shapiro said.

The missiles, four to six-feet long and Russian-made, can weigh just 55 pounds with launcher. They lock on to the heat generated by the engines of aircraft, can be fired from a vehicle or from a combatant's shoulder, and are accurate and deadly at a range of more than two miles.
Peter Bouckaert of Human Rights Watch first warned about the problem after a trip to Libya six months ago. He took pictures of pickup truckloads of the missiles being carted off during another trip just a few weeks ago.

"I myself could have removed several hundred if I wanted to, and people can literally drive up with pickup trucks or even 18 wheelers and take away whatever they want," said Bouckaert, HRW's emergencies director. "Every time I arrive at one of these weapons facilities, the first thing we notice going missing is the surface-to-air missiles.


this is from an administration friendly news source birdman who is confused ???

are you sure your not high?

so you have no proof just someone saying oh well I could have done this.

Mean while the Bush administration actually left Saddams weapon caches unarmed which armed the insurgency.

If you want to play the hypothetical game with Obama ill play the literal game with Bush

Cu Bu wrote:

Birdofthad wrote:

so you have no proof just someone saying oh well I could have done this.

Mean while the Bush administration actually left Saddams weapon caches unarmed which armed the insurgency.

If you want to play the hypothetical game with Obama ill play the literal game with Bush

bird your own liberal news interviewed military personnel that gave information that thousands of surface to air missiles are unaccounted for.

Rebels on the ground reported what they saw, again lending credence to why the missiles are missing

birdy come out and play