How Good is BJ Penn?

http://www.mmareligion.com/site2/?p=918

by Jason Kelly

BJ Penn, is he really that good? …

That’s a question I can’t help but ask myself. While others have written off BJ due to his last 2 losses and have announced BJ Penn has nothing left to offer them, I reflect on what he did offer throughout his career and contemplate if Penn was truly “The Prodigy”.

His “Prodigy” alias was given to him as a result of his quick BJJ accomplishments and I won’t argue those are remarkable feats but, when Penn’s MMA career is finely examined, it may tell a story that perhaps shouldn’t include the word “Prodigy”. BJ approached the MMA scene 9 years ago as a fierce, scrappy competitor at UFC 31, definitively winning his first 3 fights and acquiring a title shot against Jens Pulver. Penn lost a close decision to Pulver in that fight and this was the first evidence of BJ Penn’s inadequacy, not so much the loss but the pattern this would initiate for Penn’s career. He won his next 2 fights then he fought to a draw with Caol Uno, a man Penn destroyed some 13 months prior, from there a period began that could be considered BJ’s greatest run of his career.

From October 2003 to July 2005 Penn sported a record of 5-1. That single loss was from one of his crazy epiphanies that made Penn think it was a good idea to fight Lyoto Machida at Machida’s weight. In that time Penn defeated Takanori Gomi, Matt Hughes, and 2 Gracie’s. BJ appeared to be the “Prodigy” we all believed would decimate any fighter on his radar however, BJ lost his next 2 fights to GSP and Matt Hughes. Notice a pattern yet?

Penn came back strong to avenge his loss to Pulver, and then continued to make Joe Stevenson and Sean Sherk resemble novices. BJ, with 3 consecutive wins, decided he wanted a bout at 170 against GSP and with his 3 victories at that time, considering the fashion they were finished in, fans believed Penn might get his revenge on GSP. Penn’s history repeated itself as he lost to a fighter who was willing to fight him, following suit of his career; except this time he provided outlandish excuses. His complaining and accusations of St. Pierre using greasing agents and partaking in steroids only tarnished Penn’s image, having fans not give him the respect of a warrior, due to his childish and unsportsmanlike behavior.

Penn came back to win 2 at 155, beating 2 credible foes in Kenny Florian and Diego Sanchez but, as soon as Penn was back to his winning ways, he dropped a fight and belt to Frankie Edgar, there’s Penn’s pattern surfacing again. This brings us to probably the most important fight in BJ Penn’s career, Edgar vs. Penn 2. Its evident BJ wins a few then drops one but, not many thought he would lose to Frankie the first time, their second fight was supposed to be the return of BJ –again- and Frankie was supposed to get damaged. Frankie beat Penn again, and this time was worse than the first. BJ could make no excuses, he simply did the same thing he has always done; he starts to lose to guys who actually fights him and he quits before the fight is done. BJ had facial expressions of not caring to be there in their second fight, and his corner provided insignificant motivation.

Penn’s recent loss to Frankie is going to be the loss that keeps his name unmentioned in the same breath as GSP or Anderson Silva. He has taken criticism his entire career from Dana White for not taking the sport seriously and lacking conditioning. Fans often wonder which BJ Penn is going to show up to fight. Penn has had mesmerizing highlight reel finishes and when he comes to fight, you can guarantee entertainment; but with winning 2 of his last 5 and looking worse in his second fight against Frankie, can you still call him one of the best? With only 2 title defenses and his longest winning streak being only 4 fights, can BJ Penn even be considered an all time great?

can't you atleast copy and paste part of what you are talking about? Instead of always trying to get us to go to mmareligion?

When ever I see a thread like this I just ignore it... No matter how good it may or may not be.

I want some compensation Iceberg. Give me some love on you're site.

He's good enough to get beat.

Should we trash this? not just because it's another shameless plug for this guys website but because half the page is full of how good is BJ Penn? was he ever that good? what happened? blah blah threads.

KingsOwn19 wrote:

Should we trash this? not just because it's another shameless plug for this guys website but because half the page is full of how good is BJ Penn? was he ever that good? what happened? blah blah threads.

The delete button is probably and even better option. But then again Ninja himself saw this thread and did nothing to it.

Ninja\Rua/Fan wrote:

I want some compensation Iceberg. Give me some love on you're site.

I dont have a site,

OUSOONERSOU wrote:

can't you atleast copy and paste part of what you are talking about? Instead of always trying to get us to go to mmareligion?

Not my site neither r the other sites i post from. its pasted, sorry.

Maybe it's just a blog site he checks that none of us do.

BJ Penns inadequecy????

seriouly??? really?

for losing to a prime Jens Pulver

I quit reading after that sentence

Birdofthad wrote:

BJ Penns inadequecy????

seriouly??? really?

for losing to a prime Jens Pulver

I quit reading after that sentence

I agreed with that part bc that is the first sign of BJ's ups and downs, his win 3 lose 1 sort of ways. BJ Penn is one of my fav fighters of all time, and I dont think he is finished, he's just doing his usual thing. Frankie has his number, bj would kill almost any other LW, I see a rematch with Gomi in the works after BJ lost 2 in a row.

No way does getting outpointed in five rounds by Jens Pulver in his prime make any fighter inadequate. Thats such a ridiculous notion that I personally question both the knowledge base and motive of anyone who even implies such a thing.

completely agree Ludo its a fucking retarded statement

but that was the beginning of his ups and downs and the career he has had shows that

and Pulver barely beat him, so i wouldnt say his loss to pulver matters to much as far as BJ's legacy goes, BJ is one of the most skillful fighters when he wants to be

The Pulver fight was another fight that by rights he should have won. That's the deal with BJ Penn. A bunch of Shaqian what-if's.

Losing a 5 round decision to a top 3 all time lightweight in his prime who when they fought was the number one lightweight in the world makes one inadequate? Up's and down's My ass. He lasted five rounds standing with Jens fucking Pulver after destroying Caol Uno in under thirty seconds. He then went on to beat Matt Serra, draw with Uno in a rematch, then choke out Takanori Gomi and then end Matt Hughes' first title reign. After that he beats Duane Ludwig, a Gracie, loses a decision to a 215lb Lyoto Machida and then beats Renzo. If your talking inadequate your not talking about BJ Penn.

completely agree Ludo this writer is a dumbass

LudoCain wrote:

Losing a 5 round decision to a top 3 all time lightweight in his prime who when they fought was the number one lightweight in the world makes one inadequate? Up's and down's My ass. He lasted five rounds standing with Jens fucking Pulver after destroying Caol Uno in under thirty seconds. He then went on to beat Matt Serra, draw with Uno in a rematch, then choke out Takanori Gomi and then end Matt Hughes' first title reign. After that he beats Duane Ludwig, a Gracie, loses a decision to a 215lb Lyoto Machida and then beats Renzo. If your talking inadequate your not talking about BJ Penn.

The first pulver fight is def a bad addition to the article, Penn was very young, Pulver was in his prime. But the overall theme stands. Penn come's into some of these fights, just not ready to go.

captain organic wrote:

LudoCain wrote:

Losing a 5 round decision to a top 3 all time lightweight in his prime who when they fought was the number one lightweight in the world makes one inadequate? Up's and down's My ass. He lasted five rounds standing with Jens fucking Pulver after destroying Caol Uno in under thirty seconds. He then went on to beat Matt Serra, draw with Uno in a rematch, then choke out Takanori Gomi and then end Matt Hughes' first title reign. After that he beats Duane Ludwig, a Gracie, loses a decision to a 215lb Lyoto Machida and then beats Renzo. If your talking inadequate your not talking about BJ Penn.

The first pulver fight is def a bad addition to the article, Penn was very young, Pulver was in his prime. But the overall theme stands. Penn come's into some of these fights, just not ready to go.

I will not disagree that Penn has come into plenty of fights well under his talent level. He has always been alot like Rampage in the regard that he seemingly hates to be in the gym all the time training. If you were to bring up the GSP fights or the second fight with Hughes(maybe not if you factor in the rib injury) you have a point to make. But to use a five round decision loss to a Prime Jens Pulver which has been disputed by some as a means to say "this is where the pattern began" is ridiculous. Does the overall concept that BJ Penn has a tendency to lose "it" after a string of wins? Absolutely. Did it start with Pulver? Absolutely not.

Sure it did. BJ himself long cited training and regretted not taking the initial bout more seriously. Part of why a second fight with Jens haunted him for so long.

He said the same thing about the GSP fight. Yet in the Primetime show leading up to UFC94 he was off partying still.

Birdofthad wrote:

completely agree Ludo this writer is a dumbass

WHAT! Blasphemy.

I don't know about you guys but every time I see a thread from iceberg I get all excited that I finally get to read up on a new MMAReligion article. It's a breath of fresh carbonyl sulfide.

hhahah never visited there so i guess they suck