Juan Manuel Marquez will never get that third opportunity against Manny Pacquiao

Despite lightweight champ Juan Manuel Marquez's pleas for a third fight with Manny Pacquiao following his dominant win against Juan Diaz in their rematch last week -- a fight promoter Golden Boy also wants to make -- Top Rank's Bob Arum, Pacquiao's promoter, put the kibosh on it.

Arum intends to match Pacquiao with Antonio Margarito for a vacant junior middleweight belt on Nov. 13. Marquez is not in the picture, he said.

"Marquez is a terrific kid and a terrific fighter, but he's a smaller-weight fighter," Arum said. "He demonstrated that at the higher weight he can't handle it [when he lost every round to Floyd Mayweather at welterweight last fall]. Now, if that perception is incorrect, let Marquez go fight a bigger guy and prove that he belongs with Manny at a higher weight.

"Let him go fight Andre Berto or [Joshua] Clottey, Tim Bradley or [Devon] Alexander. If he beats one of those four guys, he can say, 'I belong with Manny at the higher weight.' Pacquiao demonstrated that he can go up, but Marquez hasn't. Maybe he can, but he needs to show it." Arum said Pacquiao, who now holds a welterweight title, would not drop down to junior welterweight to meet Marquez, either.

"Once a guy goes up, you don't bring him down, especially if he's the A-side," Arum said.

Pacquiao and Marquez fought to a controversial draw in their first fight, one that many believed Marquez won, for the featherweight championship. Pacquiao claimed a controversial split decision in their rematch for the junior lightweight title, another fight many believed Marquez won.

http://espn.go.com/sports/boxing/notebook/_/id/5441621/devon-alexander-hard-work-dedication-paying-off

Sadly I agree with Arum even though I really want to see that fight again.

BUMMER!!!!!!!!!!!!!

that was decided the moment Arum pushed for PacDiva to vacate the ring title at 140 and go to 147, a move I hated and still don't understand.

Canvas wrote:

that was decided the moment Arum pushed for PacDiva to vacate the ring title at 140 and go to 147, a move I hated and still don't understand.

I understood it when he did it. At the time the only big fighter at 140 was Hatton and he already KO'd him. He moved up for bigger better fights. Hell even now the 147 division is better than the 140 division. Pac went after the best comp available.

soonermark890 wrote:

Canvas wrote:

that was decided the moment Arum pushed for PacDiva to vacate the ring title at 140 and go to 147, a move I hated and still don't understand.

I understood it when he did it. At the time the only big fighter at 140 was Hatton and he already KO'd him. He moved up for bigger better fights. Hell even now the 147 division is better than the 140 division. Pac went after the best comp available.

I don't agree at all.

Manny moved up for the money not the better comp, Alexander and Bradley are more difficult challenges for Manny than Margarito and Cotto are it this stage in their careers.

Welterweight hasn't been a good division since 2008, Jr Welterweight is a vastly more interesting and exciting division.

Ali_1748 wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

Canvas wrote:

that was decided the moment Arum pushed for PacDiva to vacate the ring title at 140 and go to 147, a move I hated and still don't understand.

I understood it when he did it. At the time the only big fighter at 140 was Hatton and he already KO'd him. He moved up for bigger better fights. Hell even now the 147 division is better than the 140 division. Pac went after the best comp available.

I don't agree at all.

Manny moved up for the money not the better comp, Alexander and Bradley are more difficult challenges for Manny than Margarito and Cotto are it this stage in their careers.

Welterweight hasn't been a good division since 2008, Jr Welterweight is a vastly more interesting and exciting division.

NOT at the time he moved up. Also you really think that Alexander and Bradley are better than Pac and Floyd? The WW division is better right now.

The Welterweight division is overrated.

Apart from Pacquiao,Berto,Clottey and Mayweather the division is poor. Judah's moved down,Cotto,Cintron,Williams and Mosley have moved up.

The only reason people cream over is it's where Pacquiao fights at.

Jr Welterweight has

Amir Khan
Devon Alexander
Timothy Bradley
Victor Ortiz
Zab Judah
Marcos Maidana
Juan Urango
Paulie Malignaggi
Mike Alvarado
Lamont Peterson
Ricky Hatton
Joan Guzman
Maizer Mabuza
Julio Diaz
Kendall Holt

soonermark890 wrote:

Ali_1748 wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

Canvas wrote:

that was decided the moment Arum pushed for PacDiva to vacate the ring title at 140 and go to 147, a move I hated and still don't understand.

I understood it when he did it. At the time the only big fighter at 140 was Hatton and he already KO'd him. He moved up for bigger better fights. Hell even now the 147 division is better than the 140 division. Pac went after the best comp available.

I don't agree at all.

Manny moved up for the money not the better comp, Alexander and Bradley are more difficult challenges for Manny than Margarito and Cotto are it this stage in their careers.

Welterweight hasn't been a good division since 2008, Jr Welterweight is a vastly more interesting and exciting division.

NOT at the time he moved up. Also you really think that Alexander and Bradley are better than Pac and Floyd? The WW division is better right now.

140 was a better division when Pac moved up last year. I posted many many times on the subject. Bradley had 2 trinkets, Alexander, and the JMM trilogy were all there for Pac to finish his ATG career at a more comfortable weight. I knew the Mayweather fight wouldn't happen and it didn't.

I think Bradley and Alexander would have a better shot against Pac than anyone at 147 (other than Floyd).

I also think 140 was/is better than 147. If there is no Floyd and Pac, how strong is 147 right now?

Capt, Ali, you are both right. 140 was and is the better division for Pac. The problem is Uncle Bob has no one at 140 but has two thirds of 147 under contract.

Remember 600 000 buys is better than 1 million buys when you keep all of the profits and are guaranteed to have the winner under contract.

Arum and Golden Boy are both trying to run their own de facto boxing leagues. It is an absolute disservice to the sport.

I'm beginning to wonder Top Rank and Golden Boy are worse for the sport than the alphabet organizations. I think the answer is still no at this point, but a few years ago I never would have even debated such an idea.

Ali_1748 wrote:

The Welterweight division is overrated.

Apart from Pacquiao,Berto,Clottey and Mayweather the division is poor. Judah's moved down,Cotto,Cintron,Williams and Mosley have moved up.

The only reason people cream over is it's where Pacquiao fights at.

I think I will take Pac, Floyd, Berto, and Clottey over Alexander, Bradley, Khan and Maidana. Hell I am not sure if there is a guy in the 140 division that can beat any of those 4. Besides Mosley is a WW. If you consider Bradley a JW then Mosley is a Welter.

captainanddew wrote:

I think Bradley and Alexander would have a better shot against Pac than anyone at 147 (other than Floyd).

I also think 140 was/is better than 147. If there is no Floyd and Pac, how strong is 147 right now?

But it does have Pac and Floyd. So what you guys are saying is that we have the two best fighters of the last ten years and another future HOFer in Mosley and yet that division is not as good as a bunch of unproven tallent. OK that makes sense to me.

You guys have to be fucking kidding me. When pac moved up to 147 it was by a mile the best division in all of boxing. Do you guys even remember that?

captainanddew wrote:

Arum and Golden Boy are both trying to run their own de facto boxing leagues. It is an absolute disservice to the sport.

I'm beginning to wonder Top Rank and Golden Boy are worse for the sport than the alphabet organizations. I think the answer is still no at this point, but a few years ago I never would have even debated such an idea.

I couldn't agree more. As a matter of fact, GBP and TR should just take it a bit further and rebrand as: The Ultimate Boxing Championship and World Extreme Boxing. They could then release their own in-house rankings and award their own "championship" trinkets. That seems to be what works with the kids today.

Ali_1748 wrote:

Jr Welterweight has

Amir Khan
Devon Alexander
Timothy Bradley
Victor Ortiz
Zab Judah
Marcos Maidana
Juan Urango
Paulie Malignaggi
Mike Alvarado
Lamont Peterson
Ricky Hatton
Joan Guzman
Maizer Mabuza
Julio Diaz
Kendall Holt

And Khan aint fighting any of them.

SlickMoneyXL wrote:

Ali_1748 wrote:

Jr Welterweight has

Amir Khan
Devon Alexander
Timothy Bradley
Victor Ortiz
Zab Judah
Marcos Maidana
Juan Urango
Paulie Malignaggi
Mike Alvarado
Lamont Peterson
Ricky Hatton
Joan Guzman
Maizer Mabuza
Julio Diaz
Kendall Holt

And Khan aint fighting any of them.

Whats funny is most of those names are washed up fighters. Also NOT one of them can handle the top 5 WW's in the world right now.

Guzman, Urango, Mabuza, Diaz, and probably Holt are not relevant at 140 right now. After Zab steps up in competition and gets crushed, he'll be irrelevant also.

soonermark890 wrote:

SlickMoneyXL wrote:

Ali_1748 wrote:

Jr Welterweight has

Amir Khan
Devon Alexander
Timothy Bradley
Victor Ortiz
Zab Judah
Marcos Maidana
Juan Urango
Paulie Malignaggi
Mike Alvarado
Lamont Peterson
Ricky Hatton
Joan Guzman
Maizer Mabuza
Julio Diaz
Kendall Holt

And Khan aint fighting any of them.

Whats funny is most of those names are washed up fighters. Also NOT one of them can handle the top 5 WW's in the world right now.

Khan and Alexander could handle Berto.

Editing gone wrong?

bobbitt15 wrote:

Editing gone wrong?

LOL I guess I hit the wrong button.

Ali_1748 wrote:

soonermark890 wrote:

SlickMoneyXL wrote:

Ali_1748 wrote:

Jr Welterweight has

Amir Khan
Devon Alexander
Timothy Bradley
Victor Ortiz
Zab Judah
Marcos Maidana
Juan Urango
Paulie Malignaggi
Mike Alvarado
Lamont Peterson
Ricky Hatton
Joan Guzman
Maizer Mabuza
Julio Diaz
Kendall Holt

And Khan aint fighting any of them.

Whats funny is most of those names are washed up fighters. Also NOT one of them can handle the top 5 WW's in the world right now.

Khan and Alexander could handle Berto.

No they cant. Berto is faster, larger (and I mean naturally larger not height) and hits much harder. Khan would get KO'd inside 6 rounds. Alexander might be able to get it into the late rounds but I doubt it.

I think Alexander has something. I wouldn't count him out vs Berto.