Hey Bird

dmar5143 wrote:

sooner here we go again..first its 7 titles for pac not 8..noo it doesnt mess me up at all.hey a former flyweight won the real LH crown .carpentier so pac going from 106 to 147 dont mess me up..again please read.armstrong had 3 titles fought for the middle title and got a draw..thats close to 4 at the same time.if he fought today or even then and there was a 130 and 154 division he didnt fight the 140 lbder but is there any doubt if he did is there a doubt that he would of not won..giving him 6 at the same timew and if there were 3 or 4 middle champs since garcia was a dam good fighter and a philipino by the way he could have had 7 at the same time..your hung up on that one feat of pacs where i say greb in 1919 had 43 fights beat 6 REAL hofamers and no losses in ONE year is far more impressive than pacs 7 titles.anyone disagree with that dominance..or that armstrong would of not won at 130 or 140 or 154..come on..hagler and the other guy are not top tenors i dont care what anyone says.period.nor is green p4p the best as you listed him before ward destroyed him...pac for the most part of his career had huge vulnerable points..extremly poor balance could not take a body shot.with thoses weaknesses and easy to hit armstrong saddler bnewnny leanord and several other fighters and i mean several others would of kick the shit out of pac and destroyed him inside 8..thats fact not fiction..it took years for freddie roach to turn him into a more complete and yes great fighter..even given that at 126 pacs no match for saddler pep ot arguello for example who would of time the shit out of him..duran benny leanord at 135 eat him up.at 147 forget it.hearns robinson leanard basilio mickey walker and others would crush him..
look im a pac fan and yes his feat is excellent..armstrong would of done the same but ONLY would of had 6 or 7 titles at the SAME time..grebs 1919 overshaddows anything pac ever did.armstrongs 21 defenses in 2 years also does.jimmy wilde at 112 or106 destroys him...pacs a great one indeed.a top 8 of all time.surely you are joking..a fantastic feat yes.the greatest feat ever.nooo.i just listed 3 that are greater feats..lets rule out louis cause he dominated only one division...please.your hung up to much on pac who has flaws even today that the all time greats i mentioned would take him apart because of it.
why cant you except that we feel pac is a all time great and the several reasons why he isnt close to a top 10..yes divsions are every 3 or 4 pounds today and thats a laughable joke.

LOL you leave Green out of this! Come on Dmar we all know I was joking when I put Green number 1.

Hey I see what you are saying and I do agree to an extent. I just dont want to be that guy who goes out and says it doesnt matter what you current fighters do you will never be one of the top 10 best. I think thats fucked up a little. Thats all. My problem is I am not saying Pac is better than any of the guys you and Bird are talking about I am saying that his resume is good enough for consideration and to just dismiss him and not look at what he is done is prejudice against this generation. Does that make since? The only problem I had was Ali and Bird bashing me and Frank for putting him on the list. The guy's resume is probably the best of the last 25 or so years. But again I get what you are saying these guys dont have 150 fights now days so I do look past that stuff when I made my list.

As for saying this guy or that guy could beat him is a different story and an entirely different topic.

Birdofthad wrote:

Canvas wrote:

Hey Bird, did you hear the Stars have cut ties with Modano ? They wont offer him a contract. If he wants to play, it wil have to be somewhere else. I'm surprised the organization didn't let him make the decision for himself.

that sucks, Mo spent alot of his money and basically is living off his last contract, plus he was playing good last season stupid move imo

they have no fucking defense so why not keep the face of your franchise around

the real problem is Tom Hicks has no money to waste on old timers cause Tom Hicks is a fucking idiot


and Frank just vause Pac is 1 or 2 P4P right know doesnt mean he is top 10 all time or even closeSo is Roy Jones top 10 all time cause he was P4P 1 for a decade? no

It's a matter of opinion Bird. I wouldn't care if Ring ranked Pacquiao number 10, I'd still say he's on my 10 all time list. Let me put it this way, things you see in their entirety are more exciting than fight films. The best era I personally lived through was the 80's, and I think Pacman would've been more than a formidable challenge for any featherweight or welterweight, including Ray Leonard. I don't put much confidence in pfp ratings. It's one magazines opinion. I never thought Tyson was the best fighter in the world and I always thought James Toney deserved much more credit than he actually received. I think Pac is great because of what I've seen on my own, not any PFP ratings.

sooner you asked what it takes for a fighter today to crack the top ten and i told you..if they do that then yes.if not then no...example i have my thoughts as who were the greatest pitchers of all time is in baseball..i have walter johnson as number one bob feller and clemons the next two..greg maddox is on that list..soo if a pitcher pitches only 6 innings a start like today dont complete games has very little shutouts etc etc wins 20 games once or twice then how does he crack the top 5 or 10 in baseball history....johnson won over 400 games pitched every year 300-350 sometimes over 400innings.today a workhorse pitcher caps out at 220 innings or so.johnson had well over 100 shutouts.pitchers today are lucky if the have 50 or 75 total complete games in there entire career...andy pettite a dam good pitcher has won more post season games then anyone in history..great feat..does that make him a top ten of all time.is he better than bob gibson christy matthewson koufax and the other ones ive mentioned...nope.why..its self explanitory..the same with fighters.in the divisions pac fought..is he a top ten in the welters .nope..top ten at 140 nope.135 nope.126 nope.does that help at all...so untill a pitcher comes along throws 100miles per hour like walter john son has tons of complete games and shutouts and is a workhorse like johnson then we can talk..the same with fighters..bird tell me whats so hard to understand.

sooner.i and i think bird also have looked at pac.by no means have i dismissed what he has done.ive said several times hes an all time great.the best of the best.a elite fighter that ranks in the top 100 fighters ever..i place him as high as 30...thats far from dismissing him.its recognising his greatness to a very high degree...thats rated over fighters that have had thoses 120-150 fights.is it not.
but its also not getting carried away by placing him number 8..its not predudice at all..its fair honest objective and knowledgeable placement based on what hes done..hes rated that high on his feats in the ring..thats a compliment since i strongly feel and know hes not a top ten welter..come on now 3 fights and hes king kong in that division by beating so so talent.yes oscar was washed up and cotto is so so compared to the near greats and very good welters..one fight at 140.does he rank as the top ten there please...one fight or so at 135..better than duran benny leanord gans ross williams beau jack and ambers and several others..nope..at 126 .dominate like pep saddler sanches arguello terry mcgovern and others ..nope..hes rated high by me cause of what hes done..if he stayed at one division maybe just maybe he falls out off that top ten in that division....noo ones overlooked him at all..there realy should be no disagreement here division by division..

to say I dont watch Pac or dont understand him cause he isnt in my top 10 all time is ludacris so Im gonn throw them bo's , sorry, and ya Tyson was way overrated Toney is was underrated

and I personally think you guys hold Pac on such a high pedestal cause you guys hate Mayweather

just my opinion

lol..who knows bird.but i have floyd in that elite list also.top 100 ever..i rate pac high cause of the 7 divisions hes won a strap and 4 were real lineal titles..when you look division by divison he dont cut the mustard so to speak as i stated..his greatness lies in that one feat and also that his style of non stop punching and pressure and stanima...is he a greater fighter than floyd..yes i think so..is he a better fighter than floyd..nope.there is a differnce.its maybe hard to understand...to qualify..abilty wise style wise fluidity wise floyds better..yet ill rate pac as the greater fighter..its just one of thoses oddball things.
and yes i hate floyd but it dont get in my way of recognizing a great speacial fighter that he is..

I cant believe Sooner still on this....

gomez1012 wrote:

I cant believe Sooner still on this....

On what Allan Green's schlong ?

Ali_1748 wrote:

On what Allan Green's schlong ?

that and Pac being top 10 ATG

I know there was another thread where you, him, and me went back on forth on it

We did indeed, lets just say Mark can be a bit stubborn at times

a bit is being polite

Birdofthad wrote:

to say I dont watch Pac or dont understand him cause he isnt in my top 10 all time is ludacris so Im gonn throw them bo's , sorry, and ya Tyson was way overrated Toney is was underrated

and I personally think you guys hold Pac on such a high pedestal cause you guys hate Mayweather

just my opinion

Nah I use to be a Mayweather fan. I respect what he has done in the ring.

Ali_1748 wrote:

We did indeed, lets just say Mark can be a bit stubborn at times

You have no idea.

gomez1012 wrote:

I cant believe Sooner still on this....

Hey I didnt bring it up this time.

Birdofthad wrote:

to say I dont watch Pac or dont understand him cause he isnt in my top 10 all time is ludacris so Im gonn throw them bo's , sorry, and ya Tyson was way overrated Toney is was underrated

and I personally think you guys hold Pac on such a high pedestal cause you guys hate Mayweather
just my opinion

Bird, I've always been a Pac fan. The first time I saw him fight Marco Antonio B., I knew he was a fighter destined for greatness. My friends and I said he reminded us of an 80's fighter, which is the highest compliment we could pay to any fighter these days. Then he beat De La Hoya, something I was surprised he did with such ease. During these times, Mayweather was retired. I don't hate MW, he just annoys the hell out of me. The less I see him, the better. I really think Pac is a special fighter.