These Black Fighters vs the White and Black Champions

These fighters vs the white and black champion of their time with the title on the line, who wins????

Peter Jackson vs John L. Sullivan - Jackson was beaten by Jeffries when he was a bit past it but Sullvian would never give him the time of day. I personally think Sullivan gets knocked out by Peter.

Sam Langford vs Jim Jeffries/Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - Langford probably beats a prime Jeffries although god damn what a fight that would have been. Langford flat out murders Hart and Burns, a prime Johnson vs a prime Langford is pugilism at its finest and is a toss up. I lean toward Johnson though (the two fought numerous times before Johnson was champ).

Sam McVey vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - I believe McVey gets beaten by Jeffries because he was simply a beast in his prime, McVey KO's Hart and Burns easily. Johnson seemed to have McVeys number and I think Johnson beats McVey unless McVey gets Johnson after the layoff going into Cuba.

Battling Jim Johnson vs Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns. Jack Johnson - Johnon losses to Jeffries also, more than likely beats Hart, whips Burns ass, and gets beaten by Jack Johnson (as we actually saw happen).

Joe Jeanette vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - simply put, if given the chance I tink he eats every single on of them. OK maybe Jeffries beats him, Johnson did beat him but I think when Johnson got lazy on beating on Great WHite Hopes he was ripe for the taking by game fighters like Jeanette.

Harry Wills vs Jack Dempsey - depends when the fight takes place, more than likely Dempsey wins.

This is my opinion, I already know my opinion, I want yalls opinions!!!!!

Birdofthad wrote:

These fighters vs the white and black champion of their time with the title on the line, who wins????

Peter Jackson vs John L. Sullivan - Jackson was beaten by Jeffries when he was a bit past it but Sullvian would never give him the time of day. I personally think Sullivan gets knocked out by Peter.

Sam Langford vs Jim Jeffries/Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - Langford probably beats a prime Jeffries although god damn what a fight that would have been. Langford flat out murders Hart and Burns, a prime Johnson vs a prime Langford is pugilism at its finest and is a toss up. I lean toward Johnson though (the two fought numerous times before Johnson was champ).

Sam McVey vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - I believe McVey gets beaten by Jeffries because he was simply a beast in his prime, McVey KO's Hart and Burns easily. Johnson seemed to have McVeys number and I think Johnson beats McVey unless McVey gets Johnson after the layoff going into Cuba.

Battling Jim Johnson vs Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns. Jack Johnson - Johnon losses to Jeffries also, more than likely beats Hart, whips Burns ass, and gets beaten by Jack Johnson (as we actually saw happen).

Joe Jeanette vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - simply put, if given the chance I tink he eats every single on of them. OK maybe Jeffries beats him, Johnson did beat him but I think when Johnson got lazy on beating on Great WHite Hopes he was ripe for the taking by game fighters like Jeanette.

Harry Wills vs Jack Dempsey - depends when the fight takes place, more than likely Dempsey wins.


This is my opinion, I already know my opinion, I want yalls opinions!!!!!

1.Jackson in his dead prime fought to a 61 round draw with Jim Corbett. In his prime? Sullivan likely knocks both men out. Had Jackson fought the worn out, alchoholic Sullivan that Corbett fought? Jackson wins. One more thing. Jackson wasn't "a bit past it" when he fought Jeffries. He'd fought like once in five years. He was a shell.

2. Langford so feared Jeffries he took out newspaper adds offering to take on all comes EXCEPT Jim Jeffries. Jeffries annihilates him. Just too much of a size difference. Langford beats both Tommy Burns and marvin Hart. In their heavyweight primes? I dunno about Johnson-Langfo0rd, but I'd still guess Johnson.

3. Agree on both McVea and Jim Johnson, though I don't know a lot about Johnson. McVea would have tried to outphysical Jeffries. No chance.

4. Jeanette is a much more interesting case because he was a gifted boxer and not just a slugger. He and Jeffries would have been fun. But I struggle to see Jeanette winning a long fight or a fight to the finish. He beats Root and Burns and loses to Lil Arthur.

5. Dempsey FEASTED on big, strong, slow guys. That's Harry Wills. A guy like Jeanette has a much better shot I think.

thanks Marble, and while I knew Jackson was not his prime self vs Jeffries I didnt knw it was that bad

thanks for the insight and opinions, glad we pretty much agree

Feel sorry for Peter Jackson cause of all of the men listed he is the one that getts lost in the shuffle the msot IMO

Its sad IMO that Hart and Burns even held the title when men like these guys where walking the ring canvas

just think if Jim Jeffries had said I retire, Sam Langford vs Jack Johnson for my title and I will ref it

how sick would that have been????

I dont know enough about Denver Ed whats your thoughts on him vs the whites Marble, I know he got beaten by Johnson thats about it

Birdofthad wrote:

just think if Jim Jeffries had said I retire, Sam Langford vs Jack Johnson for my title and I will ref it

how sick would that have been????

Well when Jeffries Retired Johnson had just lost a 20 rounder to Marvin freaking Hart and Langford weighed around 150 pounds. The divison had been thoroughly wrecked by Jeffries and it took Jonson another five years to really consolidate it again. Johnson and Langfor didn't fight until well after Jeff retired IIRC.

dah slaps head

boy am i glad your around hahahah

so surely this cant mean Hart vs Root was the best case scenario, yikes

Birdofthad wrote:

I dont know enough about Denver Ed whats your thoughts on him vs the whites Marble, I know he got beaten by Johnson thats about it

Other than the fact that he was GIGANTIC he never seemed to beat a truly tip-top guy. McVea abused him a couple of times.

thats what i thought a tough fighter but got beat by the top guys he fought

wasnt he like 6'4 which is nuts for that era?

Birdofthad wrote:

dah slaps head

boy am i glad your around hahahah

so surely this cant mean Hart vs Root was the best case scenario, yikes

Well, McVea and Johnson and Jeanette really didn't hit their strides until just a couple of years later. Lnagford was still fighting middleweights. Hart and Root may have been the best matchup right then, but just two years later my guess is they wouldn't have been at the top of the heap. By about 1907-8, the heavies were once again LOADED. But too many of them were black to get a white paying public to take notice.

Birdofthad wrote:

thats what i thought a tough fighter but got beat by the top guys he fought

wasnt he like 6'4 which is nuts for that era?

No he was like 6'7. There were some other true giant heavyweights back then. Big Bill Tate was 6'6, Willard was 6'5+, Ed Dunkhorst was like 6'4 and 240.

Thanks guys, I'm out!

holy bee sting (I stole that Ali) 6'7 is nuts

agree about the division becoming loaded its too bad, pretty impressive what guys like Langford and Barbadose Joe Walcott did fighting way abouve their regular weight class due to having to

night marble enjoy the greatest state in the union

thnks for the insight once again

Birdofthad wrote:

These fighters vs the white and black champion of their time with the title on the line, who wins????

Peter Jackson vs John L. Sullivan - Jackson was beaten by Jeffries when he was a bit past it but Sullvian would never give him the time of day. I personally think Sullivan gets knocked out by Peter.

Sam Langford vs Jim Jeffries/Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - Langford probably beats a prime Jeffries although god damn what a fight that would have been. Langford flat out murders Hart and Burns, a prime Johnson vs a prime Langford is pugilism at its finest and is a toss up. I lean toward Johnson though (the two fought numerous times before Johnson was champ).

Sam McVey vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - I believe McVey gets beaten by Jeffries because he was simply a beast in his prime, McVey KO's Hart and Burns easily. Johnson seemed to have McVeys number and I think Johnson beats McVey unless McVey gets Johnson after the layoff going into Cuba.

Battling Jim Johnson vs Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns. Jack Johnson - Johnon losses to Jeffries also, more than likely beats Hart, whips Burns ass, and gets beaten by Jack Johnson (as we actually saw happen).

Joe Jeanette vs Jim Jeffries/ Marvin Hart/ Tommy Burns/ Jack Johnson - simply put, if given the chance I tink he eats every single on of them. OK maybe Jeffries beats him, Johnson did beat him but I think when Johnson got lazy on beating on Great WHite Hopes he was ripe for the taking by game fighters like Jeanette.

Harry Wills vs Jack Dempsey - depends when the fight takes place, more than likely Dempsey wins.

This is my opinion, I already know my opinion, I want yalls opinions!!!!!

.....lets see.first langford and johnson fought only once not several times.both hit the deck but johnson had a good weight advantage..if they fought later on lets see say 3 more times sam wins i think once.against jeffireies he has no chance..jeffs bigger 210 or morer sam 158-168...both fought going foward.sams at a disadvantage...burns and hart sucked soo most of the other guys or all of them mentioned wip them..no big feat either..wills was tailor made for a prime dempsey..noo contest..jeantette has no chance against jeffires..realy look at his chin..john l in his prime takes peter jackson appart..

but what a bout an older Sullivan vs peter Jackson????

for some reason i thought Langford and Johnson fought more than once guess i was wrong