Random Thoughts on Tonight

Next time it oughtta be Fenway

-Foreman showed himself to be a very tough guy. He's also very limited in what he can do. An amateur stylist as a pro.
-Arthur Mercante Jr did Dad proud tonight. A very nice job.
-Joe Green fights like he just walked in off the street. He has NO idea what he's doing, neither does his Father.
-Freddie Roach really is a huge advantage for his fighters in the era of knucklehead trainers.
-We're all going to miss Miguel Cotto when he's gone. A real pro.
-Martyrosian is going to get knocked COLD by a left hook someday soon if he doesn't change a couple of things. He holds his chin out like a lantern in the dark and gets over his front foot way too often.
-Good crowd, good venue, good job by Bob Arum...did I just write that?
-Michael Buffer really knows how to work a crowd.

A good night for the greatest sport on the planet.

A good night indeed.

hahaha buffer is funny love how he always tells the crowd what the hell is going on

can still hear him at Fan Man

stay in your seats ladies and gentleman the fight will resume

haha

marbleheadmaui wrote:

Next time it oughtta be Fenway

-Foreman showed himself to be a very tough guy. He's also very limited in what he can do. An amateur stylist as a pro.
-Arthur Mercante Jr did Dad proud tonight. A very nice job.
-Joe Green fights like he just walked in off the street. He has NO idea what he's doing, neither does his Father.
-Freddie Roach really is a huge advantage for his fighters in the era of knucklehead trainers.
-We're all going to miss Miguel Cotto when he's gone. A real pro.
-Martyrosian is going to get knocked COLD by a left hook someday soon if he doesn't change a couple of things. He holds his chin out like a lantern in the dark and gets over his front foot way too often.
-Good crowd, good venue, good job by Bob Arum...did I just write that?
-Michael Buffer really knows how to work a crowd.

A good night for the greatest sport on the planet.

Very good points.

I completely agree on Greene with you, Marble. He's terrible.

the thing about greene is that i think that vanes was having trouble with him because he is so awkward. i do have to say that he actually had pretty good defense. he slipped punches well. he isnt a great fighter but he does have a few good points about him.

Greene looked bad.
Vanes is going to get KOd if he doesn't shore things up.

Cotto is a more than a true pro.
He is what we want fighters to be.
Took on good competition at 140 on his way up, great competition at 147, and to his detriment probably will try to fight the 4 guys at 154 he should avoid- martinez, PW, Angulo, and Cintron (Cintron less so because of his mental issues).

Foreman-limited in what he can do? YES. He has his style. If his knee is okay I think he could outbox 4 or 5 of the guys ranked in the top 10 at 154. There is nothing wrong with that. To be top 10 in a weight class and be good enough to beat 4 or 5 of the other top 10 guys is an impressive thing in this world.

captainanddew wrote:

Greene looked bad.
Vanes is going to get KOd if he doesn't shore things up.

Cotto is a more than a true pro.
He is what we want fighters to be.
Took on good competition at 140 on his way up, great competition at 147, and to his detriment probably will try to fight the 4 guys at 154 he should avoid- martinez, PW, Angulo, and Cintron (Cintron less so because of his mental issues).

Foreman-limited in what he can do? YES. He has his style. If his knee is okay I think he could outbox 4 or 5 of the guys ranked in the top 10 at 154. There is nothing wrong with that. To be top 10 in a weight class and be good enough to beat 4 or 5 of the other top 10 guys is an impressive thing in this world.

I'd like to amend my remarks to include The Captain's bolded above.

Where does Cotto go from here? If his team were smart they'd get him back down to 147. 154 is pain for him in the future. He'd want to face the guys who are naturally bigger and beat him (and some like Martinez would outbox him no matter the size difference).

Who to face at 147? Pac and Floyd probably tied up. Clottey-seen that. I wanted the rematch, before Clottey refused to punch against Pac. Cotto vs. Mosley rematch-I don't know, Mosley looked his age vs Floyd. Part was Floyd, but he also looked OLD.

The logical fight at any weight is the fight he doesn't want to take.

COTTO vs MARGACHEATO 2. He's said he didn't want that fight. But you have Margo having gotten beat down vs. Mosley. And the handwraps. Is it possible that Margo is as damaged or more damaged than Cotto at this point. He has been fighting pro for a long time and leads with his face more than any fighter should.

No kind words for Vanes at all Marble ?

captainanddew wrote:

Where does Cotto go from here? If his team were smart they'd get him back down to 147. 154 is pain for him in the future. He'd want to face the guys who are naturally bigger and beat him (and some like Martinez would outbox him no matter the size difference).

Who to face at 147? Pac and Floyd probably tied up. Clottey-seen that. I wanted the rematch, before Clottey refused to punch against Pac. Cotto vs. Mosley rematch-I don't know, Mosley looked his age vs Floyd. Part was Floyd, but he also looked OLD.

The logical fight at any weight is the fight he doesn't want to take.

COTTO vs MARGACHEATO 2. He's said he didn't want that fight. But you have Margo having gotten beat down vs. Mosley. And the handwraps. Is it possible that Margo is as damaged or more damaged than Cotto at this point. He has been fighting pro for a long time and leads with his face more than any fighter should.

Give Clottey a rematch at 154lb. With Steward at his side and both eyes free of blood Miguel will erase that blemish.

Ali_1748 wrote:

No kind words for Vanes at all Marble ?

He was fighting a guy who had zero clue and he didn't dominate him. He's tall and active. But to say he's rough around the edges would be insulting rough edges.

Yeah, I rewatched Cotto vs. Clottey (couple of weeks ago) which I narrowly scored for Cotto (alot scored it for Clottey). That cut changed that fight. And Cotto did alot of retreat and move later in the fight, but he had to.

As for Vanes, freddie has his work cut out for him. I normally decry all the negativity, but he isn't fluid. He doesn't ever look that comfortable in the ring to me. Probably never will. I see his upside as limited. He can become a legit top 10 guy at 154, but he won't ever be one of the elite 3-4.

captainanddew wrote:

Where does Cotto go from here?

Cotto-Clottey-Margo 3-WAY Death Match! 3 men enter, 1 man leaves.

Two thoughts from that other place

That ref is ridiculous. In the Cotto vs Judah fight Judah's balls got smoked and he told him to "Walk it off your a champ" when hes laying on the ground clinching his man hood after he took a Cotto hook. Then tonight tells Foreman to walk it off when he can't even walk to his corner without limping. Then the towel came in and then he cleared the ring and continued the fight. The fight should of been over then but instead he forced Foreman to continue and risk getting hurt when he couldn't move (also taking the chance of slipping again). Some people praised him for letting it continue but why? the towel came from the corner man. The announced that it didn't but after the fight the ref said it did come from him. Foreman had no chance after that injury and why would you put him out there for another couple of rounds. Just cuz you guys want to see a KO doesn't mean you should want an execution and possibly end someone's career.

They have got to find an alternative to the paint on the ring. We have seen it many times fighters slipping on the logos that were painted on recently. Dirrell slipped and got KO'd when he was down. Now Foreman slipped tonight before his knee went out. Then he slipped again after the knee problem and that one injured him even more.

I will watch a replay of the fight and try to read what I can on what occurred with the towel incident before passing judgment. I'm not sure we got a complete view of what occurred. Bits and pieces coming out last night appeared contradictory.

Before this fight, I thought Cotto was shot. I was 100 percent wrong and I'm happy as hell about it. The crow feet taste like chicken.

Gumby wrote:

Two thoughts from that other place

That ref is ridiculous. In the Cotto vs Judah fight Judah's balls got smoked and he told him to "Walk it off your a champ" when hes laying on the ground clinching his man hood after he took a Cotto hook. Then tonight tells Foreman to walk it off when he can't even walk to his corner without limping. Then the towel came in and then he cleared the ring and continued the fight. The fight should of been over then but instead he forced Foreman to continue and risk getting hurt when he couldn't move (also taking the chance of slipping again). Some people praised him for letting it continue but why? the towel came from the corner man. The announced that it didn't but after the fight the ref said it did come from him. Foreman had no chance after that injury and why would you put him out there for another couple of rounds. Just cuz you guys want to see a KO doesn't mean you should want an execution and possibly end someone's career.

They have got to find an alternative to the paint on the ring. We have seen it many times fighters slipping on the logos that were painted on recently. Dirrell slipped and got KO'd when he was down. Now Foreman slipped tonight before his knee went out. Then he slipped again after the knee problem and that one injured him even more.

COMPLETELY disagree wijth the first paragraph. It is ENTIRELY the ref's call. If Foreman wants out? All he need do nmis take a knee and a count. NOBODY can force a fighter to continue.

Agree completely on the second.

Referees are instructed to IGNORE towels that are tossd into the ring unless they personaly see the cornerman climb up on the ring apron and throw the towel. Otherwise, any yahoo could toss a towel in the ring to disrupt things, get a cheap win, or just get a cheap rest. Mecante handled the situation BRILLIANTLY CORRECTLY. Foreman was not taking serious punishment, he was punching back, he was the CHAMP, and he said I WANT TO CONTINUE!, when he was asked. Good job by Mercante. Too many referees allow fighters to milk it for an undeserved rest OR they allow a champion to lose his title without giving them the benefit of the doubt.

You got the paint part 100% correct though. That crap is dangerous.

I just read Wallace Matthews recap of the fight. What is that guy smoking?

He had the fight even at the time of the stoppage.

I agree with Gumby. Foreman can barely walk, the knee has buckled on him multiple times, he's having all sorts of trouble getting around the ring, and the corner throws in the towel, what more do you want.

And Yori was trying to be tough, he did not want to say "no I'm done" but he wanted out, his body language said it clear enough. And yes he was being a champ, he was not going to quit, and that is why the corner bailed him out, that is what the corner is supposed to do.

Mercante was walking a fine line early, telling a fighter with a bad knee to suck it up, but it was working, but once he ignored the towel he crossed that line.

and I didn't think that was a great crowd by any stretch. A puerto rican former champ and a Israeli champion fighting in NYC? I'm sure they were hoping for better then 10% of capacity.

I actually agreed with the ref letting it go on...thought it made for a better fight and gave more exposure to it. Maybe it sets a bad precedent, but it allowed the fight to reach its likely conclusion and I didn't see Foreman in danger like when a guy is wobbly from shots to the head.